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Post subject: Re: Help me figure out this tube driven mystery. Fender?
Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 8:14 am
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stratele52 wrote:
I do not read all answers but for shure is it NOT a Fender amp . It is not a Fender Chassis . This is not the way Fender build amps this kind of point to point.

Look like a Canadian amp like Lifco or some brand like that.


Probably a Fender front plate but NOT a Fender amp


It's not a Fender anything, Stratele. EL84 (above) has nailed its pedigree precisely.

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Post subject: Re: Help me figure out this tube driven mystery. Fender?
Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 8:55 am
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EL84 have a good answer . I should read before all the post.

These amps can sound very well with a few hour of tech work . I modify some of them and they sound pretty good.


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Post subject: Re: Help me figure out this tube driven mystery. Fender?
Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 10:08 am
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ryobie1 - Thanks for posting the photos and hanging in there until the various questions were answered. Definitely a learning experience. And welcome to the forum.


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Post subject: Re: Help me figure out this tube driven mystery. Fender?
Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 11:30 am
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When I shorted the resistor across the leg of the 6l6 it blew the tube along with making the resistor go away. Explains why the sound is lacking like it is. My guess is the amp is probably fine. Any one have a guess to the the resistor bands from the poicture I posted.
Tubes are a dime a dozen but the resistor is out of reach fo me because I can't see it's bands. The resistor was no match for the current going across the 6l6.

The resistor goes directly to the + speaker pole so I'm guesing it's the out put side of the reverb. I have decided to display it for a convorsation peice.
Being that it's a clone makes it more interesting to me than if it where a real one just because it.... not sure why. I took down the ebay listing now that I have good pictures here.


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Post subject: Re: Help me figure out this tube driven mystery. Fender?
Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:57 pm
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Ryobie, (+) OPT to pre-amp circuit is a feedback resistor (WAG). Or if it's the grid stopper... blowing this resistor and a 6L6GC is a sign of something bad going on. Double-checking the entire wiring section-by-section maybe in order.

Remember, the 6L6GC pinout is different than a EL84.


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Post subject: Re: Help me figure out this tube driven mystery. Fender?
Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:49 pm
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The reason they blew is because I touched the leg of the resistor to a leg of the 6l6.
My kids where reaching for the inside of the amp so I picked it up really fast while it was on and my hand pushed the resistor onto the leg of the 6l6.

The resistor's first 2 bands are black, orange. then white or grey.

I have 4 6ls's on the way for it. I'm also looking for some 12ax7's for it. Has any one tried the 6n2p conversion? they seem to be very avalable from Russia? I'm sure I'll find a thread about it.


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Post subject: Re: Help me figure out this tube driven mystery. Fender?
Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 10:18 pm
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ugh... Black Orange Gray = 300 Meg ohms. Not possible. How about Gray Orange Black ? = 83 ohms. Not exactly familiar with this resistor in a Fender amp.


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Post subject: Re: Help me figure out this tube driven mystery. Fender?
Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 1:31 am
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BMW2002Ti wrote:
Ryobie, (+) OPT to pre-amp circuit is a feedback resistor (WAG). Or if it's the grid stopper... blowing this resistor and a 6L6GC is a sign of something bad going on. Double-checking the entire wiring section-by-section maybe in order.

Remember, the 6L6GC pinout is different than a EL84.


+ 1 BME2002Ti , double check Ryobie

IMO and with this picture, this resistor do not go to a speaker +
Speaker + is never on tubes socket. Or your picture is not clear.

Can you send us a better close-up ?


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Post subject: Re: Help me figure out this tube driven mystery. Fender?
Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 3:12 am
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I'll get some better pics up.

The resistor came off pin 8 from the 6l6 then into 2 other resistors to make a Y. one of the resisotrs goes into la la land (havn't traced it) The other goes directoy to the speaker + Via a black cloth wire. does not pass go. Then it continues to the output transformer.


My new 6l6's and 12x7's came today. Least I can turn it on again. Sounds a lot better. It has no low end. As I was looking at the caps looking for one that might scream "replace me" I noteced that all the molded caps and the main are all stamped "made in the USA"
Why would a foreign clone amp have so much USA made components for gutts?


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Post subject: Re: Help me figure out this tube driven mystery. Fender?
Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 10:26 am
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First thought is this
cloth wires do not = 1950's
My 68 Bandmaster has cloth wires on two of its trannies

Second the USA made componants could have been added by someone over the years or faked in Asia back in the day.

The wiring does kinda remind me of my 57 Gibson GA-6

Could be a fun project ! 6L6GC's ??? Wow ! 40 or so watts

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Post subject: Re: Help me figure out this tube driven mystery. Fender?
Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 11:53 am
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ryobie1 wrote:
I'll get some better pics up.

The resistor came off pin 8 from the 6l6 then into 2 other resistors to make a Y. one of the resisotrs goes into la la land (havn't traced it) The other goes directoy to the speaker + Via a black cloth wire. does not pass go. Then it continues to the output transformer.


My new 6l6's and 12x7's came today. Least I can turn it on again. Sounds a lot better. It has no low end. As I was looking at the caps looking for one that might scream "replace me" I noteced that all the molded caps and the main are all stamped "made in the USA"
Why would a foreign clone amp have so much USA made components for gutts?


6L6 pin 8 , it is Kathode , this a very funny wiring , maybe a mod ..... for what ?
News 6L6 ; do you check bias ? It is a must.

USA made components, to me this amp look more a north America made amp , not foreign.

EL84 I'd like to know more about Fillipino amp ? Never heard about it . Do you have some


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Post subject: Re: Help me figure out this tube driven mystery. Fender?
Posted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 1:36 am
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Their's no bios adjustment on this amp so I have no clue how to adjust it. I took out 6l6's and replaced with more 6l6's. Should be fine. I really don't have a choice with out a bios screw.

UPDATE FROM MUSIC SHOPS:
I have had this to 7 music shops now in Portland and Slalem. NONE of them thinks it's foreign. Even after I bring it up. Their's no question about parts in it form the 50's. More than 2/3 parts inside are correct for what Fender would have been using. The newer parts in it (pots and main caps) are the only foreign stamped parts in it.

This is what they all agree on:
1, The red is not original (wrong materila). 2, It has parts from the 50's. 3, Parts are correct for what fender used. 3, Not worth investing in shop labor to restore. 4, None of them have seen another one.

I'M NOT SAYING FENDER BUILT IT. I think that's clear just by looking under it. What I'm saying is; The parts are correct for what fender would have been using at that time. I think some one parted out a fender to homebrew it.


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Post subject: Re: Help me figure out this tube driven mystery. Fender?
Posted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 2:10 am
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ryobie1,

Sure is not a foreign amp. In '50 , '60 all north american amp use almost the same parts because these are the only parts avalaible.

There are rarely bias adjustment like a pot except on FENDER, Marshall or big name amp if they are Class AB amp . For Class A amps or many AB , bias adjustment need to replace some resirtor. Any good shop can do this.

An amp need always a bias check / adjusment with new power 's tubes.

I wish to have some news from EL84 about Fillipino amp


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Post subject: Re: Help me figure out this tube driven mystery. Fender?
Posted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 2:39 am
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I'm with you man!!! This would be a labor of love. In my estimation, you'd have to draw a schemo(or lay-out) of what you have. Then the function of every part can be addressed. Hey Dude, I've been down this road with a '55 amp(no where as complicated). But the principle is the same. Stratele makes a good point, which again speaks to the need of somekind of hard copy of the circuits. Art

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Post subject: Re: Help me figure out this tube driven mystery. Fender?
Posted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 2:55 am
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stratele52 wrote:
BMW2002Ti wrote:
Ryobie, (+) OPT to pre-amp circuit is a feedback resistor (WAG). Or if it's the grid stopper... blowing this resistor and a 6L6GC is a sign of something bad going on. Double-checking the entire wiring section-by-section maybe in order.

Remember, the 6L6GC pinout is different than a EL84.


+ 1 BME2002Ti , double check Ryobie

IMO and with this picture, this resistor do not go to a speaker +
Speaker + is never on tubes socket. Or your picture is not clear.

Can you send us a better close-up ?

I can do ya one better than a close up picture.
I have thought about drawing a schemo of it but that will be a last resort.
You tube video, underneeth side of the amp HD. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3IL9VYG ... e=youtu.be

This is the phlipino amp I think he is refuring to.
Image
Image


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