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Post subject: Need some help identifying odd speakers in a 65 Super Reverb
Posted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 6:35 pm
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I've got a '65 (tube chart date OF) Super Reverb I've had since '66 new, one of my main two small/medium gig travel amps and yea it's got it's road worn look, but no harm. I have a second '65 SR that I left untouched for the studio.

A few times I had my old Amp Tech change out the top two speakers while I was experimenting for a different sonic quality. The bottom two speakers have always been the original Oxford model for the Super R. Well I've decided to sell this "roadie" amp of mine and I have no idea what the top two speakers are. (My old - literally - Amp Tech retired years ago and is somewhere up in Washington St., probably bear bait by now).

I'd like to tell who ever buys my 'ol baby what those two top speakers are and their approximate date of mfg. Here's the PhotoBucket web page: http://photobucket.com/65super-reverb There is a close up pic of the "mystery" Fender Speakers.

Helpers out there? Thanx.

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Post subject: Re: Need some help identifying odd speakers in a 65 Super Re
Posted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 6:59 pm
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VG, Welcome! Those top two "look" like the 10-inch CTS alnicos (and "137" number stamped on frame?).


Bottom two look like ceramic magnet speakers. Any ID numbers on them? (iike "465" for Oxford?).

The number will be six digit, usually. Like "137431" = 137 = CTS. 4 = 1964. And 31 = 31st week.

I'll whip out the old trusty camera and take a few photos of my CTS 10-inchers. ASAIGBFD. Hungry.


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Post subject: Re: Need some help identifying odd speakers in a 65 Super Re
Posted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:17 pm
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All of my CTS alnco 10-inchers appear to have a Blue "Fender Special" sticker over the back side of the magnets. Sorry.


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Post subject: Re: Need some help identifying odd speakers in a 65 Super Re
Posted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:32 pm
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BMW2002Ti wrote:
All of my CTS alnco 10-inchers appear to have a Blue "Fender Special" sticker over the back side of the magnets. Sorry.


Still, both of the top two speaker have the 137 prefix, one follows 7022, the other 7214. So doesn't that mean they are still CTS Alnico?

The other number is 064121, is that the date code??


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Post subject: Re: Need some help identifying odd speakers in a 65 Super Re
Posted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:49 pm
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code of "137022" prolly =

137 = CTS manufacturer

022 = 1960 0r 1970. 22nd week

" 137214 "


137 = CTS

214 = 9162 (or 72), 14th week.

"064121," seems to be a Fender part number code.


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Post subject: Re: Need some help identifying odd speakers in a 65 Super Re
Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2012 3:39 pm
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BMW2002Ti - Thanks for the details. The last time I had the Tech change out the top two was around 71 or 72. But I guess that doesn't mean anything. Do you know when was the last time CTS used that bronze/plum colored frame finish? 60's or 70's?

Checked the bottom speakers, there are no numbers of any kind on the frames and only one can you see numbers on the magnet. 064121 and another that is partially covered by the Fender donut label is I think a 5 or 8 then 749. Both are the exact same speaker, but now I recall had to be re-conned some 30 years ago and has a repair label over the magnet with the donut label put back over the repair label (which I can't get off now). Though one speaker has Green dot sticker and the other a Red dot sticker.

Oxfords or Utah's?

Thanks guys.


Last edited by vintageguitarz on Wed Sep 05, 2012 4:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: Need some help identifying odd speakers in a 65 Super Re
Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2012 3:49 pm
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vintageguitarz wrote:
BMW2002Ti - Thanks for the details. The last time I had the Tech change out the top two was around 71 or 72. But I guess that doesn't mean anything. Do you know when was the last time CTS used that bronze/plum colored frame finish? 60's or 70's?

Checked the bottom speakers, there are no numbers of any kind on the frames and onlu one can you see numbers on the magnet. 064121 and another that is partially covered by the Fender donut label is I think a 5 or 8 then 749. Both are the exact same speaker, but now I recall had to be re-conned some 30 years ago and has a repair label over the magnet with the donut label put back over the repair label (which I can't get off now). Though one speaker has Green dot sticker and the other a Red dot sticker.

Oxfords or Utah's?

Thanks guys.


They are Oxfords....Oxford 10L6's if my memory is correct. Here is a link for looking up the EIA codes for speakers.
http://www.webervst.com/codes.html

By the way, I just edited my post, I notice your '65 BFSR is a brother to my '65 (also an OF)...here are a couple pics of it...Mine came with CTS Ceramics...fairly rare, they must have really been knocking them out at Fender to have two different types of speakers in the same type amp in one month!
Image
Image
Image

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Post subject: Re: Need some help identifying odd speakers in a 65 Super Re
Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:05 pm
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So, how much do you want for it?


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Post subject: Re: Need some help identifying odd speakers in a 65 Super Re
Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:47 pm
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Grenade1 wrote:
So, how much do you want for it?


If you're asking T2Stratman on his sweet Triple A condition 65 BF Super Rev, I'd guess a small fortune.

My rather road worn (lots of memories) but not abused, no-so Triple A '65 is listed on Craigslist for " $1800. or best (not lowest or low-ball) offer, Cash only, local sales ONLY."

I don't think it's appropriate to post the CL URL here, so if you're interested search Craigslist Orange County CA for "Fender '65 Super Reverb Amp - Real Vintage, not a reissue"


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Post subject: Re: Need some help identifying odd speakers in a 65 Super Re
Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:21 pm
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CTS's bronze/plum basket finish was discontinued around 1970, replaced by a silver lacquer. However, an alternative black-enamel color was also available and remained in use well into the late '70s on both the ceramic and alnico types.

"064121" was the FMI P/N for a 25-watt 10-inch speaker from any authorized vendor. The number may be seen on CTS speakers as well as those made by Oxford. The CTS alnico version may be found in the Vibrolux Reverb, Super Reverb, and Super Six Reverb.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Need some help identifying odd speakers in a 65 Super Re
Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 4:58 pm
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Retroverbial wrote:
CTS's bronze/plum basket finish was discontinued around 1970, replaced by a silver lacquer. However, an alternative black-enamel color was also available and remained in use well into the late '70s on both the ceramic and alnico types.

"064121" was the FMI P/N for a 25-watt 10-inch speaker from any authorized vendor. The number may be seen on CTS speakers as well as those made by Oxford. The CTS alnico version may be found in the Vibrolux Reverb, Super Reverb, and Super Six Reverb.

Arjay


So those top two "Plum" finish CTS 10's aren't as new (later 70's) as I thought, rather no younger than 1970. Were they only used in Silver Face models, because I don't recall ever seeing that color in Black Face amps, at least one's I've had the chance to use or check out. Do you recall what models Fender used those in?

I have a Silver Face Vibrolux Reverb which I always thought was a 1976, silver grill cloth with tan interweave (no blue or orange) and it has what I think are Oxfords with kinda dark "Plum" or Brown anodized speaker frame bodies. Serial number on a Fender "sticker" on the back of the chassis is A33745.

Pictures below, the pics of the speaker is not easy to see the color, but it it decidedly a dark plum or brown anodized. Definitely not black. Ps - Thanks for all the input!!

Image
Image
Image
Image


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Post subject: Re: Need some help identifying odd speakers in a 65 Super Re
Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 5:41 pm
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...for the record He!! No my BFSR is NOT FOR SALE...EVER! :lol:

And yes it is all original except one CTS speaker was changed for an oxford (currently looking for a CTS Ceramic Replacement from 65!). And the best part is I only paid $1K for it! After I opened it up, it was all original, every single cap, etc, only the power tubes were changed, still had the British made Mullard GZ34 in it! It sounds wonderful to boot!

Vintageguitarz...As for your vibrolux, if I am reading the label on those oxfords right and seeing the grill cloth and logo, I would put it at aroudn 76/77. If you can post a better pic or throw up some pics of the transformers we can nail it down a bit better. By the way, that is a nice one! :mrgreen:

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Last edited by T2Stratman on Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: Need some help identifying odd speakers in a 65 Super Re
Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:17 pm
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They look like Oxford 10L6's from the 33rd week of '76, Tony (if I'm reading the tag correctly). Which is consistent with the amp's rust/orange grill cloth, a hallmark of the 74-77 silverfaces.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Need some help identifying odd speakers in a 65 Super Re
Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:24 pm
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Retroverbial wrote:
They look like Oxford 10L6's from the 33rd week of '76, Tony (if I'm reading the tag correctly). Which is consistent with the amp's rust/orange grill cloth, a hallmark of the 74-77 silverfaces.

Arjay



Agreed...sure looks like 33 week of '76 on the label.

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Post subject: Re: Need some help identifying odd speakers in a 65 Super Re
Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:44 pm
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T2, as clean as that BFSR is and the price you stole it at, you better keep it .... retirement fund there in a dozen years!

Arjay,
re. the Speaker codes on the SFVR - That jives with the Fender "sticker" S/N indicating a late '76. Just learned about also using the Orange/Tan or Blue or Sparkle interweave in the grill cloths to help broadly identify mfg dates - that of course if it wasn't changed. Thanks for the confirm, the numbers you saw are correct. Glad to know that they are Oxfords, which I like the tone better than Utah's and the Jensen's Fender bought.

I got this amp off the original owner, another session guitarist friend who wanted a USA made Kramer Pacer Custom guitar I had at the time back in the 80's. I liked those Pacers, but in the long run I really made out since the value of those Kramer's went flat and the SF 70's Fenders have taken off beyond belief. :mrgreen: I love this Vibrolux Rev as much as my 66 Twin Reverb .... which breaks my back every time I try to move it. The VR is a tremendous small venue amp, mic'd or not. I've played a number of times through a mint BF Vibrolux in the studio and I don't hear any major difference to mine, except I swear my SF is a bit more "clean" and stone quiet. Apparently CBS got their crap together by mid-late 70's on the Silver Face amps after screwing up the earlier ones?? I know there is a big controversy on this subject.


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