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Post subject: Re: PICTURES ONLY * Surround your Axes w/Favorite VINTAGE AM
Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 12:48 am
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Retroverbial wrote:
Left-coast priorities are sure different from those of us living in flyover country...... :shock: Arjay


Very correct. Us "LEFTY" progressive rockers eat it up and then while "flying over"
your desert wasteland, we do dump the "bull $@!&" right into your fried cactus desert BBQs
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Post subject: Re: PICTURES ONLY * Surround your Axes w/Favorite VINTAGE AM
Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 4:39 am
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Topp... you wrote

"Then we got into the big "hand-wired point-to-point" discussion of which someone could only come up with a couple of pre-1947 amps that were "truly HW & PTP" I was called all kinds of things because the ENTIRE USA AMPLIFIER MARKET uses the terms HAND-WIRED and POINT-TO-POINT. But no, I was shot down as if THE ENTIRE AMPLIFIER MARKET had no right to change the meaning of those terms as applied to modern or boutique amps. Here is the beautiful part to you, you man of principle: I happen to own a Bruce Zinky designed 1994 Fender Tone Master amp head. Checking page one of the FENDER MANUAL, in clear concise ENGLISH, the Fender Tone Master manual clearly states: “Upon further inspection one will notice many features which set it (the Tone Master amp) apart from anything offered before. The Tone-Master is a hand-made, point-to-point wired, tube instrument amplifier. There are no solid-state (transistor) devices in the signal path of any kind. This amplifier was created from the efforts of a handful of top craftsmen, players and designers who saw a need and envisioned a new amplifier.”

You know, I deserve a BIG APOLOGY and tons of flowers. Of course some will say Fender is wrong and YOU ARE RIGHT and all of the thousands of modern boutique amp ads are wrong. My point was to only say those terms (HW & PTP) have evolved since 1947. OMG! Could Toppscore have been right?"

On this point you are wrong and I think you need to put this one to bed. The manufacturing industry has misused the term as we have already told you. Please read enough of this article to understand what the term means.

http://www.geofex.com/article_folders/p ... -to-pt.htm

Point to point construction and hand wiring are two different things. Point to point construction is hand wired but hand wiring something does not mean it is point to point construction, it simply means that the wiring has been done by hand. Many electronic devices consist of PCBs that are hand wired into a chassis. That is not point to point construction.

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Post subject: Re: PICTURES ONLY * Surround your Axes w/Favorite VINTAGE AM
Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 5:52 am
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Arc, great link for P2P, handwiring, tagboard, etc description. RG Keen has some of the finest posts on amps. My idea of true handwiring, P2P is shown in this Luminesence pre-amp I helped restore. Noticed the raised copper wire grounding strap? Which is grounded to single points on the chassis. And some very nice red based RCA 5691 and 5692 tubes.

You can see how easy it is to change-out or modified a part or section of this unit.

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Post subject: Re: PICTURES ONLY * Surround your Axes w/Favorite VINTAGE AM
Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 6:57 am
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Toppscore wrote:
Retroverbial wrote:
Left-coast priorities are sure different from those of us living in flyover country...... :shock: Arjay


Very correct. Us "LEFTY" progressive rockers eat it up and then while "flying over"
your desert wasteland, we do dump the "bull $@!&" right into your fried cactus desert BBQs
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


Ironic that you spend hours typing byzantine and nebulous diatribes against everyone here on this forum yet you can't manage a few minutes to shoot and post some photographs of the gear you CLAIM TO OWN. Everytime I read your rambling rationalizations I'm reminded of Humphrey Bogart's Captain Queeg sitting in that witness chair, endlessly palming the ball bearings in the court martial scene of "The Caine Mutiny".

:mrgreen:

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: PICTURES ONLY * Surround your Axes w/Favorite VINTAGE AM
Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 7:04 am
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+ 1 for R.G. Keen :D

One more try Arc-n-spark? I applaud the effort, but it's already been said several times, and Topp just won't accept it. Funny how one wrong reference somehow equals "the whole industry". People also abuse the term "reissue", to describe something that was never an "issue" to begin with, and using that term doesn't change reality. Example, the MIM "Classic Series '50s Strat", referred to as a "reissue". :roll:

You can lead a horse to knowledge, but you can't make him think. :lol:

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Post subject: Re: PICTURES ONLY * Surround your Axes w/Favorite VINTAGE AM
Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 7:18 am
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Shim your going to be part of the shuck and jive crew if you keep talking like that. :lol:


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Post subject: Re: PICTURES ONLY * Surround your Axes w/Favorite VINTAGE AM
Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 7:20 am
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My bad shim you are part of the crew.


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Post subject: Re: PICTURES ONLY * Surround your Axes w/Favorite VINTAGE AM
Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 7:30 am
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Pretty good company I guess. :| Well, except for maybe the Mennonite guitar player from Tenn (JK). :lol:

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Por favor, disculpe mi español, no se llega a la práctica con mucha frecuencia.


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Post subject: Re: PICTURES ONLY * Surround your Axes w/Favorite VINTAGE AM
Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 7:46 am
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Arc-n-spark wrote:
Topp... you wrote

"Then we got into the big "hand-wired point-to-point" discussion of which someone could only come up with a couple of pre-1947 amps that were "truly HW & PTP" I was called all kinds of things because the ENTIRE USA AMPLIFIER MARKET uses the terms HAND-WIRED and POINT-TO-POINT. But no, I was shot down as if THE ENTIRE AMPLIFIER MARKET had no right to change the meaning of those terms as applied to modern or boutique amps. Here is the beautiful part to you, you man of principle: I happen to own a Bruce Zinky designed 1994 Fender Tone Master amp head. Checking page one of the FENDER MANUAL, in clear concise ENGLISH, the Fender Tone Master manual clearly states: “Upon further inspection one will notice many features which set it (the Tone Master amp) apart from anything offered before. The Tone-Master is a hand-made, point-to-point wired, tube instrument amplifier. There are no solid-state (transistor) devices in the signal path of any kind. This amplifier was created from the efforts of a handful of top craftsmen, players and designers who saw a need and envisioned a new amplifier.”

You know, I deserve a BIG APOLOGY and tons of flowers. Of course some will say Fender is wrong and YOU ARE RIGHT and all of the thousands of modern boutique amp ads are wrong. My point was to only say those terms (HW & PTP) have evolved since 1947. OMG! Could Toppscore have been right?"

On this point you are wrong and I think you need to put this one to bed. The manufacturing industry has misused the term as we have already told you. Please read enough of this article to understand what the term means.

http://www.geofex.com/article_folders/p ... -to-pt.htm

Point to point construction and hand wiring are two different things. Point to point construction is hand wired but hand wiring something does not mean it is point to point construction, it simply means that the wiring has been done by hand. Many electronic devices consist of PCBs that are hand wired into a chassis. That is not point to point construction.


Excellent link. Certainly describes how I learned things lo those many years ago. :lol:

Like I said in an earlier post on this subject; point-to-point has become the "kleenex" and "xerox" of the guitar amp world. If you use the wrong term often enough, it becomes the accepted term. :roll: Notice I didn't say it becomes the "correct" term. :wink:

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Last edited by bluesky636 on Mon Jul 09, 2012 8:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: PICTURES ONLY * Surround your Axes w/Favorite VINTAGE AM
Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 8:02 am
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" Pretty cool axe. There are 36 notes between octaves, rather than the typical 13 notes. "

Interesting, I guess. I just bend to get semi-tones... maybe old school.

A hint (now don't take it too personally, please)--- might help your street cred to remove the price tag... before the photo shoot.

Just a thought. :mrgreen:


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Post subject: Re: PICTURES ONLY * Surround your Axes w/Favorite VINTAGE AM
Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 8:09 am
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Location: Natural Bridge, Virginia
tbazzone wrote:
Shim your going to be part of the shuck and jive crew if you keep talking like that. :lol:


Ya know, some people might consider referring to someone as part of a "shuck and jive crew" to be rather racist. Just something certain people may want to consider. Not referring to you, of course. :wink:

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Post subject: Re: PICTURES ONLY * Surround your Axes w/Favorite VINTAGE AM
Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 8:11 am
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shimmilou wrote:
Pretty good company I guess. :| Well, except for maybe the Mennonite guitar player from Tenn (JK). :lol:

:shock:
Now that's funny shimmy! :lol:

One thing that's happened regarding the "point to point" term is that it's been made popular by the industry and had been misused by advertising as far back as Topp's famous "Zinky" amp,I guess....just like other things that we see here argued over constantly,calling it what it isn't,doesn't make it right.
One thing that was mentioned in a post on this forum was how the oldtime radio/tv repairmen were to deal with....I grew up with an uncle who was a ham radio guy in the late '50s and graduated from U of Tennessee as an electrical engineer in '65,he went to work for NASA in the space program weeks after graduation,I remember my grandfather and my uncle working on electronics in the '50s and '60s,ham gear,and Fender tweed amps,so I clearly understand when a misused term doesn't set right with guys like we have here.
I feel the same after working in the electrical utility business for 36 years and the accurate names for things we use for circuits and connections.


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Post subject: Re: PICTURES ONLY * Surround your Axes w/Favorite VINTAGE AM
Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 8:12 am
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Location: Natural Bridge, Virginia
BMW2002Ti wrote:
Interesting, I guess. I just bend to get semi-tones... maybe old school.


If you really need a guitar with a lot of notes to impress people, just go fretless. :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Post subject: Re: PICTURES ONLY * Surround your Axes w/Favorite VINTAGE AM
Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 8:14 am
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Rock Star
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bluesky636 wrote:
tbazzone wrote:
Shim your going to be part of the shuck and jive crew if you keep talking like that. :lol:


Ya know, some people might consider referring to someone as part of a "shuck and jive crew" to be rather racist. Just something certain people may want to consider. Not referring to you, of course. :wink:

:lol: yeah!!
If I had started that term and being from the redneck South,Topp would have reported me,for treating people like "Steppen Fetchit" in the oldtime movies.


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Post subject: Re: PICTURES ONLY * Surround your Axes w/Favorite VINTAGE AM
Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 8:16 am
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BMW2002Ti wrote:
" Pretty cool axe. There are 36 notes between octaves, rather than the typical 13 notes. "

Interesting, I guess. I just bend to get semi-tones... maybe old school.

A hint (now don't take it too personally, please)--- might help your street cred to remove the price tag... before the photo shoot.

Just a thought. :mrgreen:

Me too...I can bend to any note I want....that guitar would be worthless to me!


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