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Post subject: Re: Silverface Grill Cloth & Drip Edge Trim * Source Buy Rep
Posted: Thu May 10, 2012 11:44 pm
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mxvin wrote:
Well....I didnt say the replacement of the resistors weren't necessary its just my opinion that when I see so many replaced and the ones they did replace it was a wholesale type of maintenance on the amp. Not a bad thing just an observation.
I am very partial to the Drip Edge era amps especially the black line models. Personally I wouldn't trade up for for BFTR. Thats a personal decision you'll have to make. I would invest in better speakers for the 68. Don't know what your motivation for wanting to trade up is. The description of your amp and the picture are all a potential buyer would need. Good luck....


MXVin. Your statement is that you collect and study early Silverface Fender
amps with the black line. I heard that indicates the Blackface electronics,
that were naturally installed at the Fender Factory BEFORE the change over to
the AC568. Arjay states that May is an absolute divider between AB763-AC568

So, being the beginning detective that I am, please help figure a "puzzle"? PLMK
what you or any forum member thinks, feels, believes or has an opinion towards:

The below picture shows my 1968 Twin Reverb is a 1968 Blackline Faceplate:

Image


The following three photos are of the 1968 Twin Reveb.
I was told, that an expert could look at a Fender amp
and see if the amp is a natural AB763 circuit or will be able to see
the famous Blackface mod that's been performed to make it a AB763 circuit.

Since you collect "black line faceplate amps", what do you instantly know
about the amp with black-lines on the faceplate? Do you think Blackface
circuitry within an early Silverface amp? Or, do the black-lines mean something else?

I'd like to know what I have regarding the circuitry.
Is it a natural Blackface from the Fender Factory?
Is it a Blackface circuit that has been modded?
Is it not modded and it is not a Blackface but is a AC568?


I do have more pictures if you need them. Just tell me which component photos you desire.

Image

Image

Image

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Last edited by Toppscore on Fri May 11, 2012 2:50 pm, edited 5 times in total.

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Post subject: Re: Silverface Grill Cloth & Drip Edge Trim * Source Buy Rep
Posted: Fri May 11, 2012 6:33 am
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I've never heard that the black lines indicated anything,they were on the first silverface panels,as far as anything I've heard they are only cosmetic,the late '67 and early '68 would still be the BF circuitry,but Arjay's statement matches everything I've read.
Here's the link to the schematic for the AB763 Twin and layout.
http://www.webphix.com/schematic%20heav ... _schem.pdf


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Post subject: Re: Silverface Grill Cloth & Drip Edge Trim * Source Buy Rep
Posted: Fri May 11, 2012 6:34 am
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Here's the schematic for the AC568.
http://www.webphix.com/schematic%20heav ... _schem.pdf


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Post subject: Re: Silverface Grill Cloth & Drip Edge Trim * Source Buy Rep
Posted: Fri May 11, 2012 6:38 am
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This link shows the changes from AB763 vs. the AC568 circuit...look toward the bottom of the page,the changes are circled in red on a schematic....if your amp has been "blackfaced" you will be able to see what has been changed.
http://fenderguru.com/amps/twin-reverb


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Post subject: Re: Silverface Grill Cloth & Drip Edge Trim * Source Buy Rep
Posted: Fri May 11, 2012 6:43 am
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Here ya go,the layout and what to look for.
http://fenderguru.com/wp-content/upload ... layout.png


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Post subject: Re: Silverface Grill Cloth & Drip Edge Trim * Source Buy Rep
Posted: Fri May 11, 2012 2:59 pm
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Wow. Layout/Schematic City. Thanks, Arjay.
Not a schematic person, but will give it an effort.

Regarding the "Blackline Faceplate" maybe I can better reword the question:
Since the Blackline Faceplate appears on the early Silverface Twin Reverbs
from 1967-1968, obviously, Blackline Faceplates and Blackface circuitry
would coincide together.

Therefore, the question from me to MXVin, Arjay or any early Silverface expert:
Has ANYONE owned or experienced a true 1968 AC568 Fender Reverb with
a Blacklined Faceplate???


When did Fender stop shipping Blacklined Faceplates :?:

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Post subject: Re: Silverface Grill Cloth & Drip Edge Trim * Source Buy Rep
Posted: Fri May 11, 2012 3:11 pm
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Toppscore wrote:
Wow. Layout/Schematic City. Thanks, Arjay.
Not a schematic person, but will give it an effort.

Regarding the "Blackline Faceplate" maybe I can better reword the question:
Since the Blackline Faceplate appears on the early Silverface Twin Reverbs
from 1967-1968, obviously, Blackline Faceplates and Blackface circuitry
would coincide together.

Therefore, the question from me to MXVin, Arjay or any early Silverface expert:
Has ANYONE owned or experienced a true 1968 AC568 Fender Reverb with
a Blacklined Faceplate???


When did Fender stop shipping Blacklined Faceplates :?:


Most times they do but sometimes they dont. You really have to see the inside the chassis to be 100%. back in the day they weren't so crticle on stuff like this. My experience is limited to only a handful of 68' Fenders. Three were black line and all three were black face circuits. The other two 68s were the next evolution.


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Post subject: Re: Silverface Grill Cloth & Drip Edge Trim * Source Buy Rep
Posted: Fri May 11, 2012 3:47 pm
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mxvin wrote:
Most times they do but sometimes they dont. You really have to see the inside the chassis to be 100%. back in the day they weren't so crticle on stuff like this. My experience is limited to only a handful of 68' Fenders. Three were black line and all three were black face circuits. The other two 68s were the next evolution.



OK, MXVin. Thanks for the input.
So, in my case we have an August 1968 Amp with Blackline FacePlate,
but is 3-4 months past the AC568 changes/modifications.

Dang. This is an example of how rumours are sustained.

Toppscore 8)

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Post subject: Re: Silverface Grill Cloth & Drip Edge Trim * Source Buy Rep
Posted: Fri May 11, 2012 3:57 pm
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Thank you again, Arjay, for the above schematic links.
Sorry, but I cannot understand them.

Is there anybody that can see the above three 1968 Fender Twin Reverb
and notice if it is Blackfaced naturally or if the original circuit was Blackfaced.

If I recall correctly, I read that a capacitor added was a dead give-away
that the Blackface mod was done?

Anyone with ideas or comments?

Thanks, Toppscore 8)

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Post subject: Re: Silverface Grill Cloth & Drip Edge Trim * Source Buy Rep
Posted: Sat May 12, 2012 3:27 am
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You have me confused with Arjay,he's Retroverbial....anyway it's hard for me to tell from your pics,but from what I'm seeing the pairs of 6L6GCs are not connected by the caps that are mentioned as changes to the AC568 schematic...at least I don't see them if they're there,and the other components changes would take a close looking to by someone who can tell what values the caps and resistors are....in other words,someone who has more knowledge of the two,the AB763 vs. AC568.
If I was taking a SWAG (scientific wild $@! guess),yours looks like the AB763....someone will correct me I'm sure,but that's what we're all here for. :wink:


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Post subject: Re: Silverface Grill Cloth & Drip Edge Trim * Source Buy Rep
Posted: Sat May 12, 2012 5:58 am
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Rebelsoul wrote:
You have me confused with Arjay,he's Retroverbial....anyway it's hard for me to tell from your pics,but from what I'm seeing the pairs of 6L6GCs are not connected by the caps that are mentioned as changes to the AC568 schematic...at least I don't see them if they're there,and the other components changes would take a close looking to by someone who can tell what values the caps and resistors are....in other words,someone who has more knowledge of the two,the AB763 vs. AC568.
If I was taking a SWAG (scientific wild $@! guess),yours looks like the AB763....someone will correct me I'm sure,but that's what we're all here for. :wink:


Thanks. I want to know. I will try to post more pictures that might show the
power tubes' circuit, if I can. Thanks again. Much appreciated. Toppscore

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Post subject: Re: Silverface Grill Cloth & Drip Edge Trim * Source Buy Rep
Posted: Sat May 12, 2012 8:58 am
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Quality high-resolution photos such as this would be a big help......

Image

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Silverface Grill Cloth & Drip Edge Trim * Source Buy Rep
Posted: Sat May 12, 2012 9:07 am
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Right! the better the pics the more people can tell,let me say though,a couple of the components have been replaced that I can see,so it could have been "blackfaced" if not that way from the factory.


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Post subject: Re: Silverface Grill Cloth & Drip Edge Trim * Source Buy Rep
Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 2:51 am
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PART #1 of 2
Hi. Following are four close up photos of my 1968 Fender Twin Reverb. The goal is
to find the correct picture that will show if this amp is one of three possibilities:
1) came from Fender with the blackface AB763 circuitry installed
2) came from Fender as AC568 circuitry, but was later "blackfaced"
3) came from Fender as AC568 circuitry, and has no blackface modificaions at all.

Any comments or in put will be greatly appreciated. Thank you.
Also, please let me know if I am showing pictures of the wrong side of the chassis.

Image

Image

Image

Image

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Last edited by Toppscore on Mon May 14, 2012 2:55 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: Silverface Grill Cloth & Drip Edge Trim * Source Buy Rep
Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 2:54 am
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Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2011 3:16 am
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PART #2 of 2
Hi. Following are three close up photos of my 1968 Fender Twin Reverb. The goal is
to find the correct picture that will show if this amp is one of three possibilities:
1) came from Fender with the blackface AB763 circuitry installed
2) came from Fender as AC568 circuitry, but was later "blackfaced"
3) came from Fender as AC568 circuitry, and has no blackface modificaions at all.

Any comments or in put will be greatly appreciated. Thank you.
Also, please let me know if I am showing pictures of the wrong side of the chassis.

Image

Image

Image

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