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Post subject: Re: '69 Dual Showman Reverb questions
Posted: Sun May 20, 2012 8:50 am
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Arc-n-spark wrote:
I hope to get to some work on it today but who knows. So much to do and so little time.


Yes. Main thing from your first post is that you now have a plan.
It is a keeper. I'tll be beautiful to you. You have goals. Good for you.

Even thought it is 85(+) watts (ultimately), the 1960s Dual Showman Reverbs
sound very nice, with good tone, clean and bright at lower volumes.

My 1968 Dual Showman Reverb went into the amp shop yesterday to investigate
motorboarding. But, I use it for fun reverb tones and do practice with it, right along
with my 1968 Twin Reverb and my 1968 Bandmaster Reverb.

These 1960s Silverface amps are considered quite good and strong.
Whether you have the blackface or the 1968 silverface circuitry, they sound real good.
I suppose you got your amp at a real good deal. You can always tolex it later.

Goodluck and take care. Toppscore 8)

***I forgot. Yesterday, my Weber Mass 200 w/headphone jack arrived.
I purchased this "super attenuator" just for the many amps I have with the
85w-105w capacity. Probably will use it for the 40w-60w amps as well.

Strongly suggest you get an attenuator so you can crank up the amp to get
those great Jimi Hendrix sounds at low bedroom levels. Also, my Mass 200
has a headphone jack for only $25 extra. This will save your neighborhood :lol:

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Post subject: Re: '69 Dual Showman Reverb questions
Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 6:53 am
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Retroverbial wrote:
Do me a favor, Ken.

Measure your valence panel (H & W) and let me know those dimensions. I *may* have some grill cloth for you, contingent upon what the size needs to be.

Arjay


I should get a chance to measure this weekend. Thanks!

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Post subject: Re: '69 Dual Showman Reverb questions
Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 7:08 am
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Sounds good. LMK and I'll check my usable scraps.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: '69 Dual Showman Reverb questions
Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 7:49 am
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Strongly suggest you get an attenuator so you can crank up the amp

I was told a long time ago that these are not that good, esp for the intended use, in BIG amps. Have they improved the protection circuitry, in recent years? An old-time tech told me: "if you wanna crank it & not have the cops banging on your door---get a smaller amp. Not an attenuator."

Thanks!


http://www.amptone.com/powerattenuatorfaq.htm


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Post subject: Re: '69 Dual Showman Reverb questions
Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 4:38 pm
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Good link, Beemer! Art

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Post subject: Re: '69 Dual Showman Reverb questions
Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 5:49 pm
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Does anyone see a problem with putting a 12AU7 in the V6 PI socket? Does the lower gain of this tube translate into lower volume out?

ArJay: The dimensions of the valence are 24 1/2 by 9 1/2.

Ken

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Post subject: Re: '69 Dual Showman Reverb questions
Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 6:36 pm
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Arc-n-spark wrote:
ArJay: The dimensions of the valence are 24 1/2 by 9 1/2.


Hokey dokey, Ken.

I'll check my stash this weekend and send you a sitrep via PM on Saturday or Sunday.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: '69 Dual Showman Reverb questions
Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 7:43 pm
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No problem at all, Ken. The 12AU7 is used in Hi Fi equipment. So Beemer would have the best ideas with these guys. As for volume, it may go down a little. The gain will be lower, so the pre amp character will change(more subtle). But, part of the PI's job is to drive the power tubes and this is about current, the 12AT7 and 12AU7 have the same current capability. The other guys, probably have a better handle on this case. Art

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Post subject: Re: '69 Dual Showman Reverb questions
Posted: Thu May 24, 2012 2:32 am
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aclempoppi wrote:
The 12AU7 is used in Hi Fi equipment.


The 12AU7 does not generate the complex harmonic overtones of higher-gain dual triodes like the 12AX7 and 12AT7. This trait is desireable for high-fidelity stereo applications but not necessarily something to be valued in a guitar amp, which develops much of its sonic character from the distortion and compression characteristics of a higher-gain phase inverter.

HTH

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: '69 Dual Showman Reverb questions
Posted: Thu May 24, 2012 7:57 am
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BMW2002Ti wrote:
Strongly suggest you get an attenuator so you can crank up the amp I was told a long time ago that these are not that good, esp for the intended use, in BIG amps. Have they improved the protection circuitry, in recent years? An old-time tech told me: "if you wanna crank it & not have the cops banging on your door---get a smaller amp. Not an attenuator." Thanks! http://www.amptone.com/powerattenuatorfaq.htm


Yes, Brad; they have greatly improved.
I've studied attenuators for a while and settled on the Weber Mass 200.
Below, I listed some links that discuss attenuators in general and the Weber attenuators
specifically. I am betting upon my discussions with Weber that you'll want an attenuator
to be twice as able as your guitar amplifier (100w amp with 200w attenuator).

Although I have a few amp heads over 100w, most are less. And, I can use my 200 Mass
with combo amps after the speaker out jack. So, with the 200 Mass, you can dial in for
2ohm 4ohm 8ohm and 16ohm speaker cabinets. You can use with any amp from maybe
a low of 10w to 150w. I would be cautious at full out impedence with a 150w amp.
100w amps with the 200w Mass 200, should be good to go as far as cranking out the
suppressed volumes. With Weber, it is suggested not to dime the amp's volume output
for long. This is where the rumours come that attenuators are bad for output transformers
and power tubes, etc. Most amps can break windows at 5-7 volume output, so it's safe
to work with that level of amp output into the Weber attenuator. From there, you can tone
the speakers down to small club levels and way down to apartment/household/bedroom
volumes. This is the reason I purchased the Weber attenuator, for home practice as well
as being able to use my louder amps more frequently. Also, the headphone jack on the
Weber Mass 200 should allow for an all-out mental war with nobody hearing late at night.

Does the Weber Mass change the amp's tone? Yes, a bit. But remember that anything
added in between your guitar pick and the speakers will change the tone. I'm going to
treat my Weber Mass like a pedal, as attaching pedals will make guitar amp tone changes,
and we all adjust the amp's tone controls accordingly. Also, a big seller for the Weber Mass 200
is the fact that it comes with a fantastic variable "Treble Compensation" control
to make the tone changes you desire. I believe the Mass 200 has many features
other hot-plates/attenuators that are dedicated to one wattage spec do not have.

My Weber Mass 200 just arrived last week. I had the headphone jack installed.
https://taweber.powweb.com/weber/mass200.htm
I have several questions in to the Weber Tech Support Team,
so I'll know more and be able to share results & ideas another time.


http://www.legendarytones.com/weberma.html

From the Ted Weber website:
http://www.tedweber.com/understandingattenuators.html

http://www.tedweber.com/atten.htm

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Post subject: Re: '69 Dual Showman Reverb questions
Posted: Thu May 24, 2012 8:19 am
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Arc-n-spark wrote:
ArJay: The dimensions of the valence are 24 1/2 by 9 1/2.


Good news, Ken -- I have sufficient cloth to do your valence.

I just sent you an e-mail, check your in-box when you get a chance.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: '69 Dual Showman Reverb questions
Posted: Thu May 24, 2012 4:25 pm
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I have no need for an attenuator really. I like the amp as is right now. Maybe that should be in it's own thread.

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Post subject: Re: '69 Dual Showman Reverb questions
Posted: Fri May 25, 2012 1:09 am
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Ken, glad you're getting into the zone with your amp. Trying different PI tubes is really cool ! I used to use RCA and Amperex 5751's in my amps. But have since reverted to the early GE halo getter 12AT7's. It's all about the journey! Have fun!!! Art

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Post subject: Re: '69 Dual Showman Reverb questions
Posted: Sat May 26, 2012 3:45 pm
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That is such a super-cool find! I'm glad you are restoring it! It would be a shame for such a great amp to sit around and never be used again.

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Post subject: Re: '69 Dual Showman Reverb questions
Posted: Sun May 27, 2012 10:48 am
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Arc-n-spark wrote:
If I decide to restore it would enhancing it with a master volume control or other mods be cool or would it detract from it's value as a vintage amp? I don't plan on selling it but plans can change.
Any and all replies are much appreciated. Thanks for


I just purchased a 1983 Fender Rivera Era Twin Reverb II amp head.
It has quite a few of the cool modern modifications. The Twin Reverb II chassis
should fit directly into the Showman. Therefore, you'll know the TRII's parts,
trannys & components will fit and work on and within your Showman's chassis.
Toppscore

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