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Post subject: 66 Pro and Twin speakers and reverb repair
Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 1:07 pm
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I recently had the opportunity [and snatched it!] to pick up a '66 Pro and a Twin, both in largely, original condition. The Pro, I should clarify, has had a three-prong conversion, and what looks like, possibly a newer speaker wire installed, which leads to my question. They are supposed to have Jensens or Celestions, how do you tell the Celestions? Are they labelled? What could I look for as far as stamped codes? These are completely unmarked, with a dark reddish-brown baked enamel finish; and they sound fantastic. I would love to know if they are an original part of this amp, which was very lightly used and then literally sat in a closet for 30 years [I bought it from the second owner].
The Twin appears to be 100% unaltered, with a two-prong plug, and everything. The speakers are orange Utahs, which no one seems to mention in connection with these amps. I have heard there were earlier, well regarded Utahs than the ones most people know from the silverface era. I'd like to know a little more about what I've got here. The only issue with this amp is intermittent popping and crackling from the reverb pan [I've isolated the source by swapping tubes and reverb from the Pro]. Given the unbelievable originality and condition of the rest of the amp, I'd like to also know if this reverb could be restored rather than replaced?
There's an "insert image" icon up there, but damned if I can figure out how to attach a picture....


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Post subject: Re: 66 Pro and Twin speakers and reverb repair
Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 1:46 pm
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The '66 Pro Reverb amp could've shipped with a number of different OEM speakers. Most common would be the ceramic Oxford 12L6 (EIA code "465-6XX"). The next most common is the ceramic Utah ("328-6XX"). It's also possible that Jensens were installed although this brand was used in decreasing numbers by this time. The Jensen would likely be a ceramic C12Q marked "2206XX".

Your Twin Reverb from the same era would use these same possible brands except they'd be rated higher for the increased output. Thus, the Oxford would be a 12T6, the Utah unmarked (as was their custom), and the Jensen a C12N. Although not mentioned in period catalog literature, the D120F JBL was available as a factory option for the Twin Reverb at this time.

HTH

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject: Re: 66 Pro and Twin speakers and reverb repair
Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 3:55 pm
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Thanks, Arjay, I realize I should have said Oxfords, not Celestions; but knowing Utahs were more common than Jensens on those Pros is new info to me. Which of those I've got will have to remain a question, because, as I mentioned, there are no labels, or numbers.stamped, printed, painted,glued or otherwise on any visible portion of either speaker cone or chassis....just reddish-brown enamel and a small, thin disk of magnet. So far I haven't found another pictured like it when I go looking for examples [I guess most have been replaced by now?]


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Post subject: Re: 66 Pro and Twin speakers and reverb repair
Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 4:31 pm
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Got any pics?

The speakers I mentioned are the only OEM types originally used in those amps -- obviously somebody's changed them out for replacements (which I'll categorize as of dubious pedigree and/or quality at this point until I have more data). Jensen began to fall from favor with FMI during the 65/66 model year due solely to cost considerations. Simply put, Oxford and Utah built to a lower price point (and diminished quality IMO).

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: 66 Pro and Twin speakers and reverb repair
Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 7:00 pm
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The '66 Pro Reverb I have came with Utah speakers...they were okay but nothing to write home about.
Congrats on the great amps!


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Post subject: Re: 66 Pro and Twin speakers and reverb repair
Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 7:15 pm
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Rebelsoul wrote:
The '66 Pro Reverb I have came with Utah speakers...they were okay but nothing to write home about.


Indeed......no redeeming social value.

Strip out the cones, pry off the magnets, line the baskets with tinfoil, then use as pie tins.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject: Re: 66 Pro and Twin speakers and reverb repair
Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 9:57 pm
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:lol: :lol: :lol:
I love chocolate pie,a 12" Utah pie pan would hold a big pie! :lol: :lol:


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Post subject: Re: 66 Pro and Twin speakers and reverb repair
Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 11:46 pm
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The fifteen-inchers are great for a quiche.

:mrgreen:

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject: Re: 66 Pro and Twin speakers and reverb repair
Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 1:23 pm
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[img][IMG]http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m533/mwj1/1966ProandTwin.jpg[/img][img][IMG]http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m533/mwj1/truestereoforthetonelab.jpg[/img][img][IMG]http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m533/mwj1/66Prospeakers.jpg[/img][IMG]http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m533/mwj1/66Twinspeakers.jpg
Well, I've spent some time trying to figure the whole upload to photobucket and adding images here; seems an awful lot like work compared to e-mailing and whats available on other sites, but if I've done something right, maybe these pix will show. Since I posted my original, I have figured out that the speakers in my Pro have to be Utahs; they're identical [except for the sticker being removed] to the ones in the Twin, but with a smaller magnet. Theoretically, I suppose then, they could have been original, with someone removing labels and adding a grey speaker wire, but with no printed codes on the frames, I guess there's no way to tell.
I owned a blackface Pro for about 18 years, but it had a single mid-60's EV in it when I bought it. I absolutely loved the bell-ringing tone out of that thing, and probably won't be satisfied till I get something like it again [alas, stolen...] . Nobody seems to like these Utahs [thanks for the great culinary advice, guys], but I don't have a sense of what I'm missing, and they sound pretty good to me, although they don't and won't match that EV.
Anybody got an opinion about feasability of getting the original reverb repaired [and a good recommendation as to where?
PS, obviously the pictures aren't showing up; I've been to FAQ and followed directions, as best as I can, but my computer skills are all seat of the pants, and many instructions just gloss over true details needed without real explanation. I've tried to copy and paste and jump through the hoops while holding my head the right way... f*#%!! it, I'm done.


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Post subject: Re: 66 Pro and Twin speakers and reverb repair
Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 2:44 pm
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There you go... your format was a bit off, you just need the link to your image and use the Img link on top, next to the "Font size" box.

Image

Image

Image

Image


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Post subject: Re: 66 Pro and Twin speakers and reverb repair
Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 3:33 pm
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Both amps are equipped with Utahs -- the Pro Reverb's seem to have non-standard paint on the frames.

For the Pro Reverb, ditch them and replace with a pair of Weber 12A150's (no dope). They'll be a very close sonic approximation to Jensen P12Q's once fully broken in.

I'd be inclined to find a nice matched pair of vintage Jensen C12N's (re-cone and re-condition as necessary). They'll deliver the classic AB763 tone that '66 Twin Reverbs are known for.

Reverb tanks are both plentiful and repairable (if matching date codes are important). The Accutronics 6-spring medium-delay type should sound especially lush.

HTH

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject: Re: 66 Pro and Twin speakers and reverb repair
Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 4:18 pm
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Beautiful amps!
Like Arjay mentioned,I put Webers in my '66 Pro Reverb but used 12F150s,the ceramic magnets....Webers are all good.
For safety's sake,install a three prong plug on the Twin,especially since you seem to have both amps plugged into a common circuit,keep the old two prong in a baggie along with anything else replaced in the future like the filter caps....if they haven't been replaced,it's not a bad idea to do so.
Once again,you have some great looking amps there. :D


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Post subject: Re: 66 Pro and Twin speakers and reverb repair
Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 9:26 pm
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Rebelsoul wrote:
For safety's sake,install a three prong plug on the Twin


+1000!

Make certain that the death caps have been disabled and/or removed as well.

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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