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Post subject: Considering Super Reverb Purchase
Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2010 1:01 pm
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I just spent some quality time playing a friend's recently acquired 67 Super Reverb. I had an early 70s model many years ago. Although I have no interest in hauling a heavy amp around to gigs anymore, I've been thinking of buying one for my music room. My budget is probably going to require buying a reissue or silverface amp. Those of you with some knowledge of the vintage Super Reverbs and the reissues I'd like some honest opinions on how good the reissue is as compared to the original blackface and early silverface SR. I'm not looking at the master volume editions. I've heard the reissue is a little "brighter" and I realize it uses a PCB. Thanks for your input.


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Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2010 1:16 pm
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IMO the weak link in the SRRI "chain" is the Eminence speakers (and I say that having the utmost respect for a lot of their non-OEM products). If those are replaced with something possessed of more of the Super Reverb's original character (Weber 10A125s, vintage Fender/CTS alnicos, original Jensen P10Qs, etc) the tone will be much improved. Add a nice set of output tubes properly biased and you'll have a "keeper".

HTH

Arjay

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Posted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 2:14 am
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Original Super reverb, Blackface or early '70 Silverface, are much better than reissue.

Reissue use cheaper parts and printed circuit board, like you said. They are not a bad amp. But Silverface is a better buying IMO and are not so expensive if you take time to find a good one.

To be honest, you could need to put $100 -$200 for a tune up when you buy it so find a good tech. It worth the money you put in.

You could sell this amp the same price (or more) in couple years, not the reissue.

I'm tech, in amps and guitar myself, I fix a lot of amp. I hope this can help you


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Posted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 7:53 am
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A long, long time ago. IN a far away galaxy I once owned a Super Reverb (AB763). I restored it & eventually sold it. Couple of hints that may help you.

When replacing the filter caps, check all the resistors in the power supply for drift. Replace any over 20% off. I replaced the 220K, 1 watt resistors across the 70mfd/350 VDC caps with brand new metal oxide types. Whichever type you use, these are kinda important resistors as they help distribute the load over both caps. Larger VDC rated caps are fine, as long as they fit under the hood. Try to use 525VDC rated 20mfd caps for the rest of the power supply. Don't run lower voltage rated ones.

I replace the bias supply caps, diode, and resistors. Clean the bias -adjusting pot (replace if necessary). And I replaced the 220K-ohm resistors leading to the 1500-ohm grid stoppers with quality 1% ones (1/2 watt reaated is ok).

You may want to replace the 470-ohm, 1 watt screen resistors with say higher wattage rated 470-ohm resistors. As long as they fit across the sockets. Heat resisted ones may make for a more stable drop in voltage.

Anyhow, these small mods usually makes to a pretty stable PS and bias PS. I ramp up all re-cap jobs with a Variac. Speakers plugged in, no guitar, volumes at ZERO. Replace any indirect heated recitifer with a direct one. I use a 5Y3GT. It'll work in 5U4GB or GZ34 units, as long as you don't put any load onto it. Put a DVM onto the B+ and measure the VDC as you crank up the Variac. The B+ should rsie in proportion to the Variac. If you see no volts of smell bad things. STOP and check all connections. Esp ones to ground.

Good luck with all that.


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Posted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 9:57 am
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Schemo for above blurb:

http://www.ampwares.com/schematics/supe ... _ab763.pdf


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Posted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:58 am
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BMW2002TI, you're not wrong about parts to replace in an old fender, but In many case you don't have to replace these parts the first day you receive the amp.

You can play with, long time and after couple months you can see if you have some money for a tune up.

I see many many amps don't have these drift resistors,
188vette could be discouraged to buy old Fender whe he see your "shopping" list.


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Posted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 5:00 pm
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No, I didn't mean he needed to swap out caps the first day. I'd only do it if the caps show signs of deformation, amp hums, or some other signs of PS distress. The previous post had suggested changing caps & I just thought I'd add a few touches that I do that have help keep the PS stable.

It's kinda guide that I use when changing PS caps in these older amps. BTW... I owned a BF Super Reverb some time ago. A very nice amp. I redid the caps and other coupling caps, resistors that drifted. I sold the amp about ten years ago. I believe the current owner still lugs the big mother around to do weekend gigs. Only changed power tubes once and still using same gain stage tubes and rectifier.

So, once the power & bias supply are stable, the crazy amp will outlast MANY new amps and consistently sound great.

I hope the OT has good luck with the amp. These can be the most rock steady things in one's life.


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Posted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 5:10 pm
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Edit: Should have mentioned, if the electrolytic caps in the power supply and/or bias supply appear to be original. Or they are 15 years older or older... I'd replace them. A blown or shorted cap can cause much more $$$ damage to the amp. My idea on these restorations is to keep the precious transformers as happy as possible. 50% or more of the tone is generated by them. And they are not easy to replace with identical units. (read: even a new boutique iron is gonna change the tone).

If cap job is done by the owner it's relatively cheap. I use Sprague ATOMS. No fancy audio-grade stuff. Run of the mill carbon comp or metal oxide resistors. Prolly under $100 worth of parts, at retail prices. A good inverstment, IMHO.

OK... enough yaddy-yaddy.

8^)


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Posted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 8:26 pm
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I agree with stratele52. If it isn't broke, don't fix it.


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Posted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 9:47 pm
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IMO It's a tough call either way. Let's say you could find an early '68(AB763), if you can do the work yourself, the amp's needs could be done according to your schedule. There's no fire drill, unless(like Beemer says) a major component is at risk. If it takes 6mos- 1yr- 2yrs to really get the amp up to your level of expectation and enjoyment, then, that's fine as long it still works in the meantime. On the otherhand, if all the work has to be farmed out, I'd probably go with a 1-2yr old reissue, with the lion's share of the warranty intact. Don't have any experience with the SRRI amps, but I do know the TRRI amps do a nice job of gettin' the vintage sound. Art

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Posted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:43 pm
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Art, well the amp tech that I learned all this stuff from told me that if the PS cap failures or the bias supply cap failures can lead to very bad things. Now, if the unit is only five years old, don't sweat it, unless you hear hum or buzzing. But, if you are talking about a 40-50 year old amp that may have its original 'lytics... you maybe working on borrowed time. This especially applies to units that have been sitting around for sometime before ever being used. I've had caps pop on first startup in an old unused amp. It's why I always use a Variac to fire up anything that hasn't been used for awhile.

For those people that redo old table top radios. Some don't change out anything (from what I've read on boards). But, then very few of these ppl crank the old Magnavox to "10." You want an amp that you don't need to worry about cranking it up and blowing fuses or power tubes. At least that is my opinion. And I redo all the 'lytics in every old amp I sell.

I'm only talking electrolytics. If you want to keep the original ones in there's a real simple way to "test" if they are ok. Unsolder one or the can. Feel it's weight. Now, get a brand new cap or cap can of similar value & feel its weight. If the old cap is significantly lighter, it's lost most of it's electrolytic fluid and won't be able to filter very well. You don't even need a fancy capacitor gauge for this test.

As for coupling caps, that's a whole different story. I ONLY replace those that have gone out of tolerance. Or ones that cause tubes to runaway. Keeping the OEM voice is quite a challenge. Different amps respond differently to the coupling caps used to replace the OEM ones.

Anyhow, this is just my 2¢ worth.


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Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 7:26 am
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Thanks to everyone for your input. I'm definitely on the search and I'll let you know what I come up with. I think between the choices I stated my preference would be the early siverface amp. Thanks again.


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Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 8:59 am
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Be prepared for possible cabinet issues with any Super Reverb built after 1969. The following year Fender ditched the tried-and-true lock-jointed corners with screw-in baffle for a less-costly rabbet-joined corner, glue-in baffle construction (with separate grill frame attached via velcro). This design is structurally weaker than the older method and the grill frequently buzzes since it is far less secure without screws to anchor it to the box. They don't resonate as well either.

HTH

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject:
Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 4:22 pm
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Yeah Beemer, I totally agree ! If the filter caps & bias cap are 20yrs old or so, they should be replaced PDQ. But other things like noisy resistors, coupling caps, speakers, or any elective or upgrade parts can be done at a reasonable pace. I too, was lucky enough to have had three older electronic repair guys, as tutors, when I jumped into this stuff. Art

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