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Post subject: Good blues practice amp?
Posted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 4:33 am
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I own a 1965 Blackface Fender Bandmaster but it is too loud for practice at home. I had a Fender Blues Junior for a time but really did not care for its sound - it was too dark and muddy for me. I am looking for a small Fender amp that I could use to practice at home. I enjoy playing blues music and was wondering about the Fender Champ - either a Blackface or an early 70's Silverface. Does anyone have any opinions on this amp or another small amp that I should consider? Maybe a Vibro Verb or a Princeton?


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Posted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 8:52 am
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Deakie -

Nice amp! the Bandmaster on its own can be a bit loud for practice.

The champ is good, but I think you'd like the Princeton better - either reverb or non-reverb. As a bonus, you can hook up your Bandmaster extension cabinet to the external speaker jack on the Princeton for some added oomph. The Princetons are great for blues - they take pedals well, easy for techs to work on, and you can start to get some grit at lower volumes but plenty of clean at bedroom levels.

I rehearse with our band with my Princeton Reverb, play live with the '65 Bandmaster shown in the picture but with a Dr. Z Brake Lite attenuator to tame down the volume if needed. I've also got a Princeton at home for practicing.

Other alternative would be to get a Dr. Z AirBrake or a THD Hotplate; you then can attenuate your Bandmaster down to a home practice level. I use the Brake Lite all the way on when practicing at home with my Bandmaster combo, and it sounds great.

Hope this helps

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'59? Bogen Challenger CHA-33, '65 Bandmaster, '65 Tremolux, 65 Showman;
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Posted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 9:51 am
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5E3 tweed Fender Deluxe or clone.

or


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3TZWAqhQLo

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Post subject: Nedorama - Thanks!
Posted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 1:26 pm
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Nedorama thanks for the reply! I had been considering the Princeton. I would like to get a pre-1977 Princeton. But do you have any thoughts on the 65 Vintage Reissue Princetons? Anybody?


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Posted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 1:59 pm
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can't speak on the reissue, but even the pull-boosts are fine - just don't use it or replace with a regular volume pot.

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'59? Bogen Challenger CHA-33, '65 Bandmaster, '65 Tremolux, 65 Showman;
'74 SF Princeton; '77 SF Princeton Reverb; Dr. Z Mini Z

Our band: http://www.facebook.com/thetoysband


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Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 12:45 pm
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+1 Princeton Reverb

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Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 6:00 pm
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I am a small wattage guy. I own a 1966 Blackface Champ..... I really like this amp. It starts to growl around 7 to 8. Stays clean at 5 - 6 and still loud enough to get that Tone. I also own a 69/70 Silverface Princeton (no reverb - but has vibrato). Nice clean Fender tone. I typically keep this amp around 6 and clean. I just haven't dimed it to distort. I think it is softer sounding than the BF Champ.

I like both of them - the BF Champ seem to have more bite... go figure.

I have a Boss 63" Fender Reverb stomp box that I place in front of both amps when I want reverb. I am REALLY happy with this set-up. Great reverb for a great price - IMHO.

I play for myself and typically play blues and blues-based rock. Either the Champ or the Princeton should serve your needs. Both can still get loud enough when I want to annoy the family :lol:

FWIW - I also own one of the new Vibro Champ XD.... I also enjoy it and the diversity of sounds you can get with the voices and the effects. I typically have my loop station in front of it.... there is considerable drop off when its in front of the the two vintage amps.

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Posted: Thu May 27, 2010 9:51 pm
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I now own three various Fender amps and have owned many other brands and other Fenders as well. I agree that a Bandmaster, while a great amp, is typically a bit loud for solo practice at home. The Champ is a nice little amp but very basic without much tonal variety. Not much clean headroom either. Great for recording and as a pedal platform for recording. I own a PR and love it. It is my favorite amp for tone. Mine started out as a 78' and has been blackfaced and had the speaker and tubes replaced. The MV pot was disabled as well. I chose a Weber Cali 10 as I wanted a neutral sounding speaker that was efficient. The Cali is certainly that ( though a little heavy ). I also use JJ 6V6 power tubes, which by most techs opinions, are not a true 6V6 but more like a hybrid of a 6V6 and a 6L6. These two changes alone increased headroom considerably and gave the amp a cleaner, tighter bass response. It is loud enough to gig with in a club, and I use it often for that. I also have a Deluxe Reverb and a Vibrolux Reverb. The Princeton smokes them both on pure sweet tone. It is also the least loud and when driven hard, has a smooth, warm distortion. The Deluxe is somewhat louder but still manageable at home. You just cannot turn it up very much. It also sounds good but not as warm as the PR. The VR seems to have the cleanest and brightest tone. This amp's tone stack is very scooped and not to my liking very much. I am currently checking out ways to warm this strident sounding amp up. I've done the obvious; 5U4G rectifier, hot biased 6V6 power tube substitution, removed the 12AX7 from V1, and put a 12AX7 in V6 ( the PI tube ). While these changes have resulted in less power and a little more distortion, it's still not to my liking. While I did not want to "mod" this amp, it appears the only way to warm this amp up is to go to work on the chassis and the tone stack.

But about a good amp for blues playing at home. The Vibro Champ XD is a good suggestion, plus all the various other lower powered tube amps currently out there. Seems like everyone is making them now: Epiphone, Bugera, Vox, Peavey, Blackheart, Blackstar, Orange and so on. I'd go to a local store and try out some various tube amps in the 5 to 15 watt range and seem what sounds good to you. One word about the Epiphone Valve Jr's. I have tried them and without mods, they are not very good sounding to my ears. There are ways to mod them to make them sound much better. But why do that if you can find an amp that doesn't need modding to begin with?

What looks good to me is the Fender Pro Jr, the Fender Vibro Champ XD, the Bugera V5, Blackheart VH5 Combo, Blackstar HT-5, VOX AC4TV, Fender Blues Jr ( highly regarded ), Marshall Class 5, Egnater Tweaker,etc.
This doesn't include all the low watt "boutique" amps out there either, like the various tweed offerings from Headstrong, Clark, Victoria, Valve Train and so on. The Fender Tweed Deluxe ( at 12 watts ) would be awesome for a low watt blues amp. An original would cost thousands. Even the custom shop re-issue 57 Deluxe is 2 grand.

My home practice amp is either my PR or a recently acquired VOX VC4TV HD . It's simple but sounds great through my 1 x 12" Avatar cab loaded with a Celestion G12H-30. My pedal board supplies reverb, chorus, delay, overdrive and compression, when I want it.

Let your ears ( and your pocket book ) be the judge. In this low watt class, these amps are usually not moved much and do not need to be indestructible. Reliable, yes. Built like a tank, no.


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Posted: Thu May 27, 2010 10:18 pm
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I'd concur with the Princeton Reverb recommendation. While the Champ, Vibro Champ, and Bronco are nice little amps the 8-inch speaker and 6 watt output are a bit anemic, both in terms of tone and clean headroom (when it's required). OTOH, the PR is loud enough for living room noodling and can get downright mean and punchy when pushed. It responds well to an OD pedal such as a Fulltone OCD or a ProCo Rat and the 10-inch driver size offers more speaker options.

Best of luck, HTH

Arjay


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Posted: Fri May 28, 2010 5:11 am
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Princeton Reverb is very hard to beat....a good silverface won't set you back as much and a pre '77 will be very close to a BF PR circuit...if you could find one that's late 60s early 70s they should be the same...if it hasn't been modded.


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Posted: Fri May 28, 2010 5:38 am
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I agree, Princeton's are a nice balance between headroom and breakup. I have a 74 Champ and I love that amp. If you run it with a 10 or 12" cab it's incredible. It's a whole different amp. IMO the Super Champ and Vibro Champ XD aren't even close in tone or build quality to the original Champs. They do have some cheesy effects built in if that's you're thing. I think they sound better without them.

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