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Post subject: Fender 1967 DUAL (in block letters) Showman
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 11:36 am
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Hello...
My '67 DUAL Showman amp sounds great...two glitches:

Vibrato is not immediately available...I bought and installed an opto coupler kit, works great but still takes 1-2 minutes for the Vibrato to work.

The amp...while very clean and "loud"...does not play nearly as loud as my "66 Super Reverb. The Showman has Svetlana Winged C tubes but they are not a matched quad and are probably close to 8 years old...would one tube, if out of the match, result in the amp not being "really loud"?

Thanks,

RB3988


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Fender Play November 2019
Post subject: Re: Fender 1967 DUAL (in block letters) Showman
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 12:23 pm
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A weak output tube would manifest the symptom you describe. Try a new matched quartet of Tung-Sol STR's (be sure to check and, if necessary, adjust the idle bias) before use.

As for the tremolo issue, I'd look for a bad coupling or cathode-bias cap in the tremolo circuit.

Are you certain your amp dates to 1967?

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject: Re: Fender 1967 DUAL (in block letters) Showman
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 1:19 pm
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Retroverbial...

Yes, it's a 1967, 4 ohm OT and a real nice sounding amp...I always get compliments at gigs...my reply is always..."It's the guitar and amp". I will try a new quad and report back. Have you had experience with Ruby Tubes 6L6GCMSTR 6L6's?

Thanks,

RB3988


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Post subject: Re: Fender 1967 DUAL (in block letters) Showman
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 2:50 pm
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The early Ruby's were pretty good (I currently have a quartet in my '78 UL Twin Reverb) but as to the newer editions I have no experience so I'll reserve any comment and defer to those that do.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Fender 1967 DUAL (in block letters) Showman
Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2019 1:17 am
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Vibrato

Look for bad solder on tremolo circuit - 12AX7. Reheat all solder
Clean tubes contact ; socket and tubes pins.
Try a new 12AX7

Low power ;
Check output Power tubes as Retro write and all 12XX7 tubes. Weak 12XX7 = low power.
New power tubes may need a new bias ; a bias check is a must

Schematic and more here;

http://ampwares.com/amplifiers/fender-b ... e-showman/

Dual Showman (63-67): 24½ x 36 x 11½, Dual Showman (67): 45½ x 30 x 11½


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Post subject: Re: Fender 1967 DUAL (in block letters) Showman
Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2019 6:09 pm
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Replace the .02 and .01 disk caps in the Tremolo circuit. A slow start is a sign of these leaking and not letting the oscillator to start.
They will probably measure OK on a cap checker. But its voltage not high enough to be a reliable guage. The oscillator runs at much higher voltage and just a little leakage will affect it.


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Post subject: Re: Fender 1967 DUAL (in block letters) Showman
Posted: Wed Aug 07, 2019 1:45 am
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+1 Tim

Issue in tremolo circuit is often a caps issue


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Post subject: Re: Fender 1967 DUAL (in block letters) Showman
Posted: Wed Aug 07, 2019 1:49 am
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stratele52 wrote:
Issue in tremolo circuit is often a caps issue


......Or a weak trem roach.

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject: Re: Fender 1967 DUAL (in block letters) Showman
Posted: Fri Aug 09, 2019 10:42 am
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Hello team...

I had already replaced the Tremolo "roach" and caps as indicated in my post. I will return to the amp and check for weak or broken solder joints and I will check all tubes and report back.

Thanks,

RB3988


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Post subject: Re: Fender 1967 DUAL (in block letters) Showman
Posted: Fri Aug 09, 2019 1:45 pm
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royb3988 wrote:
I had already replaced the Tremolo "roach" and caps as indicated in my post.

I saw no mention of replacing caps.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Fender 1967 DUAL (in block letters) Showman
Posted: Sat Aug 10, 2019 1:17 am
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Retroverbial wrote:
royb3988 wrote:
I had already replaced the Tremolo "roach" and caps as indicated in my post.

I saw no mention of replacing caps.

Arjay


You are right, just the LDR/ opto coupler

https://www.tubesandmore.com/search/nod ... %20coupler


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Post subject: Re: Fender 1967 DUAL (in block letters) Showman
Posted: Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:43 am
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Retroverbial wrote:
royb3988 wrote:
I had already replaced the Tremolo "roach" and caps as indicated in my post.

I saw no mention of replacing caps.

Arjay


I have seen "kits" advertised that include the trem roach and ceramic caps. How we would know that from the OP's first post I have no clue.

It never ceases to amaze me how people post questions here with very little info and expect helpful answers.

Post some freakin' pics, or some useful details. Otherwise, we're sitting here like:
Image

Have the electrolytic caps ever been replaced? Were all them replaced? Or just the filter caps? That could be the reason the output is low. But again, we don't know.

Otherwise, continue "shotgunning" parts until you reach a solution.

Sorry to sound harsh, but that's the mood I'm in currently. There are a lotta people here that could help you if you would let them.

Cheers,
vinyl


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Post subject: Re: Fender 1967 DUAL (in block letters) Showman
Posted: Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:50 am
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vinyl wrote:
There are a lotta people here that could help you if you would let them.


+1

Well said, sir!

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject: Re: Fender 1967 DUAL (in block letters) Showman
Posted: Sat Aug 10, 2019 8:02 pm
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Points well taken...foolish assumption on my part.

Here is the kit I installed http://amprepairparts.com/fenderbf.htm#vibrato Part #VRK-1. Once the tremolo comes on it stays on the entire gig...sometimes 4 hours...with breaks.

rb3988


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Post subject: Re: Fender 1967 DUAL (in block letters) Showman
Posted: Sat Aug 10, 2019 10:13 pm
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I'm not seeing the dual 25/25 electrolytic used for V3's cathode bypass cap.

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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