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Post subject: 70s Bandmaster Reverb TFL5005D
Posted: Tue May 01, 2018 9:43 pm
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At the guitar store I saw an early 70s Bandmaster Reverb, TFL5005D. The cloth is off the front. It has a corky looking hard material covering the front. They want $699. Any opinions would be welcome.


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Post subject: Re: 70s Bandmaster Reverb TFL5005D
Posted: Wed May 02, 2018 2:07 am
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It do not worth more , not a deal. These are not a sough after amp.
He may need some work on ; filter caps, tubes , bais adjustment... to name a few.


http://ampwares.com/amplifiers/fender/b ... er-reverb/

ImageCapture d’écran 2018-05-02 à 05.04.54


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Post subject: Re: 70s Bandmaster Reverb TFL5005D
Posted: Wed May 02, 2018 11:42 am
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stratele52 wrote:
It do not worth more , not a deal. These are not a sough after amp.
He may need some work on ; filter caps, tubes , bais adjustment... to name a few.


http://ampwares.com/amplifiers/fender/b ... er-reverb/



IMO, have to agree. Based on your description, it's overpriced.

Who knows what parts have been replaced, what parts might need replacing, pots and jacks may need cleaning.

A 69 model recently sold on ebay for $519, with the grill cloth, although there are screws in the front.

That's not to say that the one you describe is worth $519, it just means it's not worth $699.

It's basically a pro reverb in a head cabinet. The circuit can be blackfaced, even though there were never any blackface models made by Fender. The blackface and silverface Bandmaster (without reverb) have solid state rectifiers.

I would have to disagree that these are not sought after amps, maybe not as sought after, but they can be a less expensive way for a player to get a vintage amp that they want to play, not sit on a shelf and look at.

Ultimately in the end, an amp or anything else is worth whatever someone is willing to pay for it.

You won't catch me buying one of these anytime soon:
https://reverb.com/item/4935061-fender-custom-shop-old-ironsides-pro-guitar-amplifier

Even if I had the kind of disposable income that would allow such a purchase.


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Post subject: Re: 70s Bandmaster Reverb TFL5005D
Posted: Wed May 02, 2018 10:11 pm
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Thanks, guys.


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Post subject: Re: 70s Bandmaster Reverb TFL5005D
Posted: Wed May 02, 2018 11:45 pm
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vinyl wrote:
It's basically a pro reverb in a head cabinet.


Not quite that simple.

The Bandmaster Reverb (as originally designed) shares its circuit layout, tube complement, and chassis dimensions with the Super Reverb Amp. The only significant difference is, the BMR used the smaller 4Ω output tranny of the Pro Reverb. Early versions were hamstrung with the emasculated AA768 circuit but many of the more onerous features of this revision were eliminated in the AA1069 and subsequent circuits. With care, the layout can be backdated to the Super Reverb's blackface AB763 configuration. As well, this chassis can be modified into a pseudo Vibroverb by replacing the vibrato channel's middle tone control with a fixed-value resistor then installing a Vibroverb front panel. If the BMR's original O/T is retained the amp will require a 4Ω load to develop its full design power of 40 watts. Many other conversions are also possible, limited only by one's imagination.

Is it worth seven bills? Likely not as has been mentioned previously. But $500 or perhaps $550 is not unreasonable given that it's a hand-wired, all-tube platform, inspired by Leo Fender himself.

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject: Re: 70s Bandmaster Reverb TFL5005D
Posted: Thu May 03, 2018 3:42 pm
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Thanks for the reply, RJ. Hope you are doing well.


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Post subject: Re: 70s Bandmaster Reverb TFL5005D
Posted: Sat May 05, 2018 2:53 pm
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Arjay is correct, of course. I didn't think my reply through carefully, and there is a lot of mis-information out there and I don't want to add to it.

About the AA768 circuit, there seem to be 2 different versions out there, 1 that's basically so illegible it's mostly useless, but it shows a GZ34 rectifier. The other one shows a 5U4GB rectifier, but beyond that I can't tell if there are any other differences.

I played mine through an EV SRO 12 in a home brew Karlson Coupler cabinet constructed out of 3/4" plywood. I couldn't run it above 4 or 5 on the volume, even with the impedance mismatch of the speaker. The cabinet had a nice wide dispersion pattern though.


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Post subject: Re: 70s Bandmaster Reverb TFL5005D
Posted: Sat May 05, 2018 3:15 pm
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vinyl wrote:
About the AA768 circuit, there seem to be 2 different versions out there, 1 that's basically so illegible it's mostly useless, but it shows a GZ34 rectifier. The other one shows a 5U4GB rectifier, but beyond that I can't tell if there are any other differences.


+1

I too have those same drawings, sir. Which of course, presents a bit of a conundrum to a service technician. Only a handful of BMR's have ever crossed my bench but thankfully all of them were the 5U4GB version. Frankly, I'm curious as to whether any GZ34 variants actually exist.

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject: Re: 70s Bandmaster Reverb TFL5005D
Posted: Sun May 06, 2018 10:43 am
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Well I actually have one of those GZ34 BMR amps so they do exist. It is a very early ptroduction 68 so it also has the Mallory/Ajax
Blue molded tone caps, drip edge and first version SF grill cloth that only was used till around mid 68. For some reason people seem to regard these amps as less disirable than other SF amps but the truth is, they are very simular. With a few minor changes to the circuitry it can be easily 100% Blackfaced.

I have a couple other early amps, a 67 SF Deluxe Reverb and a 67 SF Pro Reverb that are factory Blackfaced and that 68 BMR is right up there volume and tone wise. There are a couple of upgraded trannies on the market that will boost the output substantially to a Super Reverb level if so desired but honestly It can hurt your ears on 4 with a Strat or Tele on 10 inside the house.


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Post subject: Re: 70s Bandmaster Reverb TFL5005D
Posted: Sun May 06, 2018 11:15 am
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roadhog96 wrote:
With a few minor changes to the circuitry it can be easily 100% Blackfaced.


Indeed! I have performed two such conversions, relying on the AB763 Super Reverb schematic as a guide. In both cases the results were magnificent. One became a 2 x 10 combo, the other remained in piggyback configuration (though the OEM Oxfords were ditched in favor of a pair of JBL D120F's).

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject: Re: 70s Bandmaster Reverb TFL5005D
Posted: Sun May 06, 2018 11:50 am
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I’m primarily using a 68 Bandmaster cab, 2 x 67 Jensen C12NA with the BMR but it does sound awesome driving the 2 x D120F cab that I have for my SFDR. Either cab sounds equaly good with the BMR.


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Post subject: Re: 70s Bandmaster Reverb TFL5005D
Posted: Sun May 06, 2018 12:05 pm
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Wow. We'd love to see pictures.

Faceplate? Blacklines? Drip rail? TFL 5005 on it? Does it actually have that god awful Teflon wire in it? Lead dress?

Inquiring minds want to know.


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Post subject: Re: 70s Bandmaster Reverb TFL5005D
Posted: Sun May 06, 2018 12:19 pm
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vinyl wrote:
Wow. We'd love to see pictures.

Faceplate? Blacklines? Drip rail? TFL 5005 on it? Does it actually have that god awful Teflon wire in it? Lead dress?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Whats the secret to posting a picture?


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Post subject: Re: 70s Bandmaster Reverb TFL5005D
Posted: Sun May 06, 2018 12:35 pm
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You have to use a pic hosting site, like Imgur, Flickr, etc. Don't use Photobucket. I use imgbb. Upload the picture(s), after you upload, you should see something like embed code, click that and it will copy to your clip board, then come back here and click the img button, and paste the code between the
brackets.

Image

Someone may be able to 'splain it better than me.


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Post subject: Re: 70s Bandmaster Reverb TFL5005D
Posted: Sun May 06, 2018 12:43 pm
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Image
This is the 67 SFDR into 2x D120F cab, 68 SFBMR into 2x C12NA 68 Bandmaster cab 67 SFPro Reverb 2x C12NA.


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