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Post subject: Voltage Drop
Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 1:26 pm
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This will end in a question, and being my 69 SR and 67 VC are involved I will post here.
Back Story: Yesterday I was going to play my SR, haven't in a while, as I use my more practical VC. Last time I used the SR there was a tube that was lively when I taped the top of the amp, so I taped each tube with a chop stick and found that the PI was the loudest ping. Went digging through my tubes found some 12AT7's.
It was a chilly weekend and I was in the basement, so instead of turning on the oil I plugged in the oscillating electric heater, took out the tube tester to find a strong 12AT7. While setting the tube tester up I could not get the Line voltage to center in the meter of my EICO666, now being a dial turns up the voltage and I had it dialed up to the max and still was short of the line, I thought voltage issue. I then put a volt meter on the receptacle and got a reading of 115 to 117vac. Strange I thought, turned off the heater and measured again this time I was 120 to 121vac, lined up my tube tester with no problem with the higher voltage, checked my tubes found some good 12AT7's, exchanged the PI the amp no longer pinged.
Side Note: Also found a Sylvania 6V6 that tested off the meter, for my VC
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Back to the saga; The voltage drop got me a little worried so did some research and found that a 5% or 6 volt drop using and electric heater is acceptable, let me say the receptacle in use is at the furthest point in my house from the Breaker box. My house was built in the mid 60's and for a few years houses were using Aluminum wiring, which I have, aluminum wire will have more voltage drop than the same size run as copper wire.
So after I swapped out the PI, I turned the heater back on, turned my SR on and while playing left the multi meter in the parallel receptacle and monitored the voltage and it stayed around 115vac. My SR sounded, responded and felt great, not sure if it was from the proper voltage it was receiving, or just for the fact I have been using my VC for a month or two and the SR just is so much more everything
My question finally; If I choose to fire up heater when I play to get that 115vac, when the room comes to temperature and the heater stops and all of a sudden I have 120 to 121vac coming at my amp, will the amp take offense to it, and do some damage. As of now I did not let the room come to temperature while using the amp I did not want to find out the hard way so before shutting off the heater I turned the amp to standby.
Any thought would be appreciated

mud


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Post subject: Re: Voltage Drop
Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 3:25 pm
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".....My question finally;......sudden I have 120 to 121vac coming at my amp, will the amp take offense to it, and do some damage........
Any thought would be appreciated "

Ouf :shock:

No problem, amp is safe. Some forum members will tell you to use surge protector or UPS,
IMO you don't need that.

About your house with aluminium wiring.....I don't know but I don't like that.
Some connections may come loose on the wall outlets to name a few :(

I'm afraid of a fire.


Last edited by stratele52 on Tue May 30, 2017 3:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: Voltage Drop
Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 3:26 pm
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mud wrote:
My question finally; If I choose to fire up heater when I play to get that 115vac, when the room comes to temperature and the heater stops and all of a sudden I have 120 to 121vac coming at my amp, will the amp take offense to it, and do some damage. As of now I did not let the room come to temperature while using the amp I did not want to find out the hard way so before shutting off the heater I turned the amp to standby.
Any thought would be appreciated


Leo specified some of the toughest iron ever made for his designs -- it's damn near bulletproof. You ain't gonna hurt nothin'......rawk on!

I would however un-ass all of that aluminum wiring as soon as you can. That stuff is a fire hazard!

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject: Re: Voltage Drop
Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 3:32 pm
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Retroverbial wrote:
[
I would however un-ass all of that aluminum wiring as soon as you can. That stuff is a fire hazard!

Arjay


+1


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Post subject: Re: Voltage Drop
Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 8:53 pm
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Not only loose connections but aluminum has a high rate of thermal conductivity. Hopefully it's 12 AWG so if you have to pull some new copper it's got some tensile strength.

UN


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Post subject: Re: Voltage Drop
Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 9:07 pm
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I guess it wouldn't hurt to inspect the AC outlets, where you are using the heater. For tightness of connections and any wiring damage. Does the outlet heat up, when you plug the heater into it?

As for that Sylvania 6V6G/GT. It has an early pre-GT size glass envelope. If it tests high & is quiet... you have a darn good tube. I have some WW2 era 6V6G (VT-107A) mil spec RCA, NU, & Sylvania tubes. You can see these VT-107A have slightly longer glass than the later "GTs."

Best darn tubes. :)

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Post subject: Re: Voltage Drop
Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 12:27 am
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Interesting.

Yes, aluminum wire sucks, it's only real advantage being lower cost compared to copper. Ideally, you need a much larger aluminum wire to get the same ampacity as a smaller copper wire.

I would definitely look into replacing the aluminum with copper..... before disater strikes. If the voltage is dropping, that means that the aluminum is getting hot, and will eventually fail, usually at a connection point, or a kink in the wire. Some space heaters are particularly dangerous, and this is just one of many instances that bears that out.

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Post subject: Re: Voltage Drop
Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 1:20 am
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shimmilou wrote:


I would definitely look into replacing the aluminum with copper..... before disater strikes. If the voltage is dropping, that means that the aluminum is getting hot, and will eventually fail, usually at a connection point, or a kink in the wire. Some space heaters are particularly dangerous, and this is just one of many instances that bears that out.



+1000


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Post subject: Re: Voltage Drop
Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 8:39 am
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Arjay, stratele52, upnorth2, BMW2002Ti, shimmilou
Thank you for your concern in regrades to the aluminum wiring and my saftey, I am well aware of the issues, a constant inspection, and concern of mine, when I first moved in 22 years ago I pig-tailed all outlet, switches, light fixtures, etc. to copper using NOALOX on the connections. Now I have been replacing the pig tails, back to just aluminum using CO/ALR standard grade receptacles, and AlumiConn connectors where I can"t, light fixtures, GFI's
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It is very costly to rewire the whole house $12,000 to $15,000, I do know it is safer to rewire than any other option, but these new option seem pretty safe, and being my last child will be out very soon, downsizing into a smaller house has been considered by my wife and myself. In the mean time I will keep inspecting, and changing out all my connections to a more compliant receptacle and pigtail device.
Thank you for letting me know that when 6 volts surge into my amp, the amp is safe, though it could be me but I do like how my amp responses at 115 volts.
BMW2002Ti Thanks for the info on the Sylvania 6V6 G, it did meter very high on my tester, past the highest mark on the scale, and I played my VC with the Sylvania in it yesterday and I think it may have been a quieter than the clear RCA 6v6GTA I am using, with nothing plugged in and volume cranked. I will use this tube for a couple of days and than switch back to the RCA, so I can absorb the difference if any, than put it away as my spare along side my spare RCA 5Y3GT
Thank you
mud


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