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Post subject: Re: 1967 BF vibro champ
Posted: Fri May 13, 2016 11:45 pm
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BMW2002Ti wrote:
CE is made with old Mallory cap can technology. Very well made. I like using the 525VDC rated can. More electrolyte fluid capacity = longer life. Esp with today's wall voltage.


+1

Go with the updated 40/20/20/20 can. The higher value for the reservoir cap will tighten up the amp's bass response, which should improve speaker performance.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: 1967 BF vibro champ
Posted: Sat May 14, 2016 8:27 am
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BMW2002Ti wrote:
CE is made with old Mallory cap can technology. Very well made. I like using the 525VDC rated can. More electrolyte fluid capacity = longer life. Esp with today's wall voltage.

https://www.tubesandmore.com/products/C-EC20X3-525


Thanks for the link I just ordered it
mud


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Post subject: Re: 1967 BF vibro champ
Posted: Sat May 14, 2016 8:36 am
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Retroverbial wrote:
BMW2002Ti wrote:
CE is made with old Mallory cap can technology. Very well made. I like using the 525VDC rated can. More electrolyte fluid capacity = longer life. Esp with today's wall voltage.


+1

Go with the updated 40/20/20/20 can. The higher value for the reservoir cap will tighten up the amp's bass response, which should improve speaker performance.

Arjay


Post subject: Re: 1967 BF vibro champ Reply with quote
BMW2002Ti wrote:
CE is made with old Mallory cap can technology. Very well made. I like using the 525VDC rated can. More electrolyte fluid capacity = longer life. Esp with today's wall voltage.

https://www.tubesandmore.com/products/C-EC20X3-525


Thanks for the link I just ordered it
mud

I just put the order on hold. Tell me which wire would go to the 40uf, I will order this a little later today as I do like the idea of a tighter Bass response, as it is definitely lacking, My thoughts were the filter cap may clean the whole thing up. So before I fire it up again, I would like to get that cap changed, and a ground wire put in and the death cap sniped, I did get a proper fuse today
mud


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Post subject: Re: 1967 BF vibro champ
Posted: Sat May 14, 2016 9:24 am
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The 40mfd leg of the cap can ties to the intersection of the 1KΩ/1W resistor in the power rail and the red 420VDC line running to the output tranny (the first drop of the HV network). If you have difficulty locating a proper late-model Vibro Champ schematic for reference, use the drawing for the silverface Bronco amp.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: 1967 BF vibro champ
Posted: Sat May 14, 2016 1:34 pm
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Very Nice... Congrats... !!

I have a pair of VCs a '65 and a '68DE... yours falls between them.

Image

Image

Image

I swapped the Mojotone American Vintage speaker it came with out of the '65 and replaced it w/ a Jensen C8R (4Ω) dating from most likely Dec. of '73 (though it could be Dec. '63 too I guess). Night and Day difference !

Image

I play the '65 mostly through a Jensen C12N from '68 which has been reworked to 3.9Ω in a combo cabinet I made to accept the VC chassis:

Image

Image

Image

It sounds amazing ! I'm gonna put the '65 chassis in there and 'mothball' the original cabinet to preserve the grillcloth, tolex and tube chart.

Sounds like you got a decent deal as these are appreciating.

I concur with the others that a Cap Can swap w/ the 40/20/20/20 is the way to go.

Cheers!

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Post subject: Re: 1967 BF vibro champ
Posted: Sat May 14, 2016 5:07 pm
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So if I go for tighter bass is this the one I want
Image
and do you think a Weller 8200, which is 100/140 watt Gun from late 60's, will be strong enough to lift the old solider, with a wick, and sucker from the chassis.
mud


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Post subject: Re: 1967 BF vibro champ
Posted: Sat May 14, 2016 6:21 pm
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That's the one.

Your Weller 100/140 gun will be more than adequate for the task.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: 1967 BF vibro champ
Posted: Sat May 14, 2016 8:00 pm
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Retroverbial wrote:
That's the one.

Your Weller 100/140 gun will be more than adequate for the task.

Arjay


Thanks I have located the intersection of the 1KΩ/1W resistor in the power rail and the red 420VDC line
on the layout and the schematic that came with my VC, and it has my SN in penciled on it. I think when I open it up again I will be able to find the right wire that goes to the 40uf lug,
mud


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Post subject: Re: 1967 BF vibro champ
Posted: Sat May 14, 2016 8:21 pm
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Lightnin MN wrote:
Very Nice... Congrats... !!

I have a pair of VCs a '65 and a '68DE... yours falls between them.



Image

I swapped the Mojotone American Vintage speaker it came with out of the '65 and replaced it w/ a Jensen C8R (4Ω) dating from most likely Dec. of '73 (though it could be Dec. '63 too I guess). Night and Day difference !



I play the '65 mostly through a Jensen C12N from '68 which has been reworked to 3.9Ω in a combo cabinet I made to accept the VC chassis:

Image

It sounds amazing ! I'm gonna put the '65 chassis in there and 'mothball' the original cabinet to preserve the grillcloth, tolex and tube chart.

Sounds like you got a decent deal as these are appreciating.

I concur with the others that a Cap Can swap w/ the 40/20/20/20 is the way to go.

Cheers!


Thanks, and you have a nice pair there yourself, More than likely I will build an open back speaker enclosure and either use 1 or 2 -10's as I have been using a 69SFSR as my main amp for 5 or 6 years, and the 10's have grown on me , kind of loud for practice, but it does sound good even at 2, or 1 or 2- 12's .
The idea of a combo cabinet that's custom sized for the VC amp and speaker sound great, and yours is coming along very nicely
mud


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Post subject: Re: 1967 BF vibro champ
Posted: Sun May 15, 2016 1:53 am
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Here's an attractive option......

Image

:wink:

The enclosure appears to be a Tremolux type, likely housing a pair of tens.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: 1967 BF vibro champ
Posted: Sun May 15, 2016 6:40 am
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Retroverbial wrote:
Here's an attractive option......

Image

:wink:

The enclosure appears to be a Tremolux type, likely housing a pair of tens.

Arjay


I bet that sounds sweet, it definitely looks sweet
mud


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Post subject: Re: 1967 BF vibro champ
Posted: Sun May 15, 2016 8:48 am
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mud wrote:
Thanks I have located the intersection of the 1KΩ/1W resistor in the power rail and the red 420VDC line on the layout and the schematic that came with my VC, and it has my SN in penciled on it. I think when I open it up again I will be able to find the right wire that goes to the 40uf lug,
mud



Here's a photo:

Image


Check versus schemo and layout. Bronco schematic used, as this shows the 40/20/20 cap can:

http://ampwares.com/schematics/bronco_ab764.pdf


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Post subject: Re: 1967 BF vibro champ
Posted: Sun May 15, 2016 9:07 am
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BMW2002Ti wrote:
Here's a photo:

Image


Check versus schemo and layout. Bronco schematic used, as this shows the 40/20/20 cap can:

http://ampwares.com/schematics/bronco_ab764.pdf


+1

Note the geometric symbols stamped on the dielectric insulator of the cap can adjacent to each terminal lug -- they match those used on the schematic.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: 1967 BF vibro champ
Posted: Sun May 15, 2016 10:17 am
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BMW2002Ti wrote:
mud wrote:
Thanks I have located the intersection of the 1KΩ/1W resistor in the power rail and the red 420VDC line on the layout and the schematic that came with my VC, and it has my SN in penciled on it. I think when I open it up again I will be able to find the right wire that goes to the 40uf lug,
mud




Here's a photo:

Image


Check versus schemo and layout. Bronco schematic used, as this shows the 40/20/20 cap can:

http://ampwares.com/schematics/bronco_ab764.pdf

Thanks BMW for the photo, that how I thought the layout was, when I was looking in and sussing it out.
I started to think about it, and that's always trouble, should I see how the VC was intended to sound by Leo's design using 20/20/20/ or should I go just go with 40/20/20. I almost bought 2 can's, than I thought about it and thought, get the 40/20/20/20 for $2 more, this way I can try it out and see what I like, I have no experience with a VC at all any thoughts

Quote:
Note the geometric symbols stamped on the dielectric insulator of the cap can adjacent to each terminal lug -- they match those used on the schematic.

Arjay

Arjay the
schematic that came with my unit does not have any geometric symbols on them just a value of 20 450 on all three, so I guess if one were to use a 20/20/20 it would not matter which lug was used
Sorry for the big image only on I could find. I noticed the 40/20/20/20 does not have a legend, will it be obvious to know the 40 lug from the others on the dielectric insulator
Image
Image
BMW your photo shows the Sideways D going to 20 3rd stage and the square going to 20 2nd stage, is this because it is a different brand of cap, from the bronco schematic it looks like side ways D 40, Square 20, Triangle 20 or am I reading this wrong
mud


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Post subject: Re: 1967 BF vibro champ
Posted: Sun May 15, 2016 11:54 am
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Dunno, about can alignment . Seems that all the ones I've done had the can aligned the same. HOWEVER, each section mfd/VDC rating should be printed on the can. Follow this as the guide.

1966 VC:

Image

BF VC before fix. Note how someone soldered two 20mfd sections together (in a 20/20/20/20 can). Where one section is usually unused. This give first section a total of 40mfd filtering.

Image


BTW... Use a good 5Y3GT rectifier, ESP if you are going to put 40mfd on the first section. I recommend a nice US made NOS tube. They are still at good price.

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=5Y ... T&_sacat=0


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