It is currently Tue Sep 30, 2014 10:56 pm

All times are UTC - 7 hours



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 17 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: 2 point or 6 point bridge?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 2:39 am 
Offline
Hobbyist
Hobbyist

Joined: Fri Jul 09, 2010 3:49 am
Posts: 23
Hi, i'm sure this question has been asked before, but-
Exactly what are he differences in the tremolo options on the 2010 range?
I beleive you can either have a 2 point or 6 point bridge depending on the model purchased.
Pro/cons and opinions much appreciated!

Thanks!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 7:29 am 
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:01 pm
Posts: 1357
Location: Los Angeles, USA
Without mentioning every model and edition made, ordinarily the highway one has a six point, the USA standard has the 2 point.

I believe the 2 point is supposedly more precise or smooth action for whammying (less friction) if you use a floater, but I am sure the same setup could be done with a 6 point, which is also known as "vintage". I do not know how much if any it effects the tone, I would imagine that has more to do with the saddles and block..but it is really a personal preference kind of thing, would not call it a deal breaker unless you hate one or the other for some reason.

Some just like the 6 point due to the vintage styling and for no other reason really. Of course the six point is classic as it has been used since the first strat was made in like 1954 I believe? Regardless that is a long run so not hard to understand why some would resist change, even if it is designed for better function.

_________________
I'm almost out of stuff to sell.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 7:51 am 
Offline
Amateur
Amateur

Joined: Sun Jun 28, 2009 7:33 am
Posts: 106
The two point system also breaks easier. I have had many body that were cracked where the pivot bolts are mounted into the body thus rendering the guitar unplayable until repaired. Super glue seem to be the ticket for returning the guitar to a playable condition.

This issue is really a deal on Squires due to the bodys wood seeming to be softer woods.

I have not seen a Custom Shop break or crack yet but I would guess that the younger folks that play cheaper Fenders as a first guitar really get on the wammy bar thus doing the damage. They are not really up top serious dive bombs and wild wammies. A sure disaster in the making for a soft wood with 1/4" of wood between the tremolo cavity and the pivot bolt.

The 6 screw system usually will break or bend the wammy bar as an after effect of wild wammies.

Thomas


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 9:13 pm 
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:01 pm
Posts: 1357
Location: Los Angeles, USA
Well the only 2010 Squiers that use the 2 point are the deluxe and the Obey, and those are made of Basswood. Since the OP did not mention if this question was regarding squires or MIA/MIM, I assumed MIA.

From what I understand Basswood is softer then Alder so I imagine heavy abuse and whammy bashing could cause damage to a 2 point or 6 point setup easier with a basswood body then Alder regardless of what model guitar it is.

However in all my years of being a strat fanatic I have never heard of the problem with a 2 point being breakage. Heck the six point trems are just little tiny screws into wood...the two point uses anchors and bolts.

I guess what it comes down to..if you are a whammy abuser look into a Floyd Rose or Kramer setup...if you just like strats and are conservative on the whammying...just look for the best deal that feels comfortable to you and sounds good to you. I would not be too concerned over tearing the bridge assembly from the body or damaging the body unless you intend on being abusive with the trem.

_________________
I'm almost out of stuff to sell.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 10:13 am 
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:50 pm
Posts: 4959
Location: ʎɹʇunoɔ ǝsoɹ pןıʍ
ebaysux wrote:
..... However in all my years of being a strat fanatic I have never heard of the problem with a 2 point being breakage. Heck the six point trems are just little tiny screws into wood...the two point uses anchors and bolts. .....


+1

Thank you. That post was so annoyingly out to lunch I didn't want to respond for fear I'd say something against forum rules.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 11:17 am 
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician
User avatar

Joined: Wed May 20, 2009 2:58 pm
Posts: 2238
Location: Adirondacks
i prefer the 6 point. I am very gentle on the tremolo and use it for very light shimmering effect that having a smooth action does not really matter. I also am a traditionalist and prefer the vintage style tremolo. Just me. Everyone has to do what they want.
ABS :D


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 11:56 am 
Offline
Amateur
Amateur

Joined: Sun Jun 28, 2009 7:33 am
Posts: 106
My post was one of real life experiance of repairing many Squire and Fenders with that problem. I did not break them. I just repaired them. Don't kill the messager.

I would guess they broke due to activity not intended for such a device.

Both 6 screw and pivot bolt models were not designed for the type of activity a Kahler of Floyd would be used for.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 1:39 pm 
Offline
Aspiring Musician
Aspiring Musician
User avatar

Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2007 12:37 pm
Posts: 310
Location: NE PA, near Scranton
I have both 6 & 2 point trems. I have broken two tremelo whammy bars with the 6-point tremelo and none with the 2-point version. I have used many more jumpy whammy motions on the 2-point because I can; the 6-point is just so much harder to initiate movement, despite removing at least one of the springs(maybe 2 springs, as I use 3 remaining springs).

So I really like my 2-point tremelo, not to mention the factory installed tremsetter and the locked Schaller/Fender tuners my Strat Ultra uses. Everything stays in tune, as well. Since getting a refret on the 1970 Strat and the previous owner's change from Fender to Schaller tuners I don't really notice much change in tune after extensive whammy moves on the 6-point.Image

_________________
2007 Classic Player Baja Telecaster
1991 Strat Ultra
1990 Gibson ES-347
1986 Yamaha SBG2100
1980 Gibson L6-S
1971 Stratocaster
Fender Stage Lead Combo
Marshall MOSFET 100 watt Amp


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 4:18 pm 
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:01 pm
Posts: 1357
Location: Los Angeles, USA
What TF seems to be implying, is that with the 6 point the arm breaks..but with the two point he has had to repair guitars because from what I gather, the wood of the body itself is breaking where the anchor points are.

Either way, if someone is busting arms or the body due to trem use..there is a weak link somewhere in the equation..and it is most likely the player.

I believe TF has seen this on Squiers which tend to be made of softer woods. I have never seen this issue with a USA standard since the introduction of the 2 point regarding damage to the body. Someone would have to be pounding and yanking on that bad boy with all they have to damage a USA alder body at the trem points.

Personally I prefer the six point because I am a traditionalist and I use the trem very conservatively, if at all. But those that use trems more liberally, swear by the 2 point. Once again a matter of personal taste and of all the factors and buying decisions regarding the trem, it never even came to mind which type will break a bar or body..since I have never heard of nor experienced this issue with either one.

I can see TF's side that a kid may bash away on it thinking he is EVH or some other 80's rock star where they overused the whammy to the point of annoyance..certainly a strat was not designed for this kind of "use", hence the floyd Rose and similar style floating trems had a market back then. Probably better that kid learn on a Squier that a guitar if disrespected and abused..will eventually break. Better to break a squier while learning (regardless of the bridge type) then a 1000 dollar USA.

_________________
I'm almost out of stuff to sell.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 7:01 pm 
Offline
Amateur
Amateur

Joined: Sun Jun 28, 2009 7:33 am
Posts: 106
Well said.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 7:17 pm 
Offline
Amateur
Amateur
User avatar

Joined: Thu Dec 25, 2008 8:29 pm
Posts: 150
Location: Martinsburg, WV
Ask me what I think of the Squier Deluxe with 2 point bridge:

http://www.fender.com/community/forums/viewtopic.php?t=34572&highlight=

Fender is of the opinion that switching to .11s may have been the cause. Not sure exactly how to set it up for those, but we'll see.

_________________
Will


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 7:31 pm 
Offline
Amateur
Amateur

Joined: Sun Jun 28, 2009 7:33 am
Posts: 106
Not me.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 7:41 pm 
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:01 pm
Posts: 1357
Location: Los Angeles, USA
Hmm..so ,maybe the basswood can not handle the stress or the 2 point in some cases? I notice on the link to the other post someone stated this happened on a american as well? Odd. I have a 2002 Standard that was busted in 3 places..one right through the bass side bridge post...yet simple wood glue repaired the entire body..and a bit of filler. The original damage had nothing to do with the 2 point trem or any tension thereof though, someone busted her up on purpose and it was not pretty.

I still stand firm that unless of a defect or extreme abuse, this should not happen ordinarily on ANY guitar body..basswood or alder. But apparently it can and has on this basswood squier, don't know what else to add really...don't buy a basswood Squier comes to mind? Or if so be gentle on the trem.

_________________
I'm almost out of stuff to sell.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: 2 or 6 bolt fulcrum tremolo's
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 9:53 pm 
Offline
Hobbyist
Hobbyist

Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2010 8:45 pm
Posts: 3
Hi I've been literally playing fender stratocasters for over 35 years and imop I seem to prefer the old style 6 bolt tremolo's I could work the snot out of them .
I prefer 6 bolts esp in my softer wood bodied stratocasters

I own some Stratocasters with 2 post ones but these usa guitars are different to me in one aspect

Being I started out playing on 6 bolt original 1959 - 61 fender tremolos on my older stratocasters in the past

Over many years I found out what works for me and hard giging and sessions I had to do lot's of dive bombs or other thing's as pull ups and imop for me because I know my 6 bolt Tremolo's syncronized tremolos I just notice my 6 bolt stratocaster's stay in tune more efficently as compared to my 2 bolt tremols . Especially if some are like me and like floating tremolo's .

I prefer 6 bolt style ones but then again it is a personal preference ...
Personally I dont use Floyd rose tremolo's . The 2 point post ideas remind me of those big bulky tremolo's
Fender made a great simple original style bridge Tremolo that has a legacy of it's own .


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 10:14 pm 
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:01 pm
Posts: 1357
Location: Los Angeles, USA
As stated previously, I also prefer the six point, but only because I am a traditionalist. Actually my favorite Strat ever was an early 70's ash with a hardtail. I have not used my USA standard much since it is still a "work in progress" but it has the two post...I got a really good deal because the body was damaged..but am looking forward to giving it some use in the future.

The following is copied verbatim from the guitars owners manual...here is why Fender feels this 2 post design is technically an improvement...

"The American Series tremolo is a floating, fulcrum style tremolo, with 2 large pivot posts. These pivot posts are "V" grooved and are mated to the knife edge slots that are cut into the bridge bass plate.

The thicker bass plate and steel spring block, coupled with the weight-
balanced, stainless steel bridge saddles, help to deliver increased sustain and an extremely well balanced tonal response throughout the instruments frequency range."

_________________
I'm almost out of stuff to sell.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 17 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 7 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Exabot [Bot] and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group